Up next in 10
As we make our way toward Midnight, Joe and Matt are making sure we know what we need to before the expansion launches. Chief among those things is the lore of Blood Elves. It starts with the Highborne and the schism between Night Elves and High Elves, which eventually led to the Blood Elves and the creation of the Sunwell.
But ancient history isn't all. Joe and Matt also discuss some of the notable figures in Blood Elf society that are important to know. Lady Liadrin and Lor'themar were in the Midnight cinematic, and the Windrunner sisters are a trio to rival the Schuylers -- with their own "and Peggy" in Vereesa -- but there are tons of characters who have had their fingers on the scale of Blood Elf nobility to discuss. From Azshara all the way to Xavius, and with the entire Scourge in the mix, the history of Blood Elves is twisty and fascinating -- and a little hard to remember. So let Joe and Matt guide you through what you need to know before Midnight.
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Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
[Music]
0:10
Hello and welcome to Lore Watch round table free form discussion about lore in your favorite media. I'm your host Joe
0:16
Perez, one of several lore focused folks from Blizzard and I've got my stalwart
0:21
companion with me today, Matt Rossi. How you doing today Matt? I crave magic. Well, that's appropriate
0:26
because what we are going to be talking about today is a little bit of a primer or at least a I won't even call it a
0:32
catching up, a casual discussion about important figures in the blood elf hierarchy. Why, you might ask? Well, if
0:40
you haven't noticed, Midnight is probably going to center along the Sunwell Plateau, the Sunwell, and Silver
0:46
Moon City. And uh Silver Moon is where the blood elves call home. So, there's a good chance that bunch of these folks
0:52
are going to show up. So, I guess we get started with Well, Matt, who are the blood elves?
0:58
They're real elves, but red. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm sorry. I mean, technically not incorrect.
1:04
They're not really red. They're more pink. Um, they wear a lot of red, basically. Yeah, they do wear a lot of red. Um,
1:10
basically, uh, trying to break this down into its easiest, most digestible elements. 10,000 years ago, a bunch of
1:18
elves named the high elves, not Yeah. No, they were called high elves, the highborn, sorry. Um, the highborn were
1:25
blood were not blood elves. My I'm having trouble with this. The highborn were calderai or night elves who were
1:32
the elite of their society because they were gifted in magic. A lot of of mages
1:38
casting spells all over the place. They they served Queen Ashara who herself was
1:44
a very powerful uh wielder of magic. And Queen Ashara kind of had to call it um
1:51
you know narcissism feels like you're underelling it because Ashara was kind
1:57
of person who thought you know I am beautiful and powerful. I'm so beautiful and powerful that really only a god
2:03
would even be worthy of my time. So she essentially when she met Sargeras
2:09
because her her uh Zavas, her chief mage was probing around the Well of Eternity and using it as a like a way to like
2:15
study other parts of the universe, she was like, "Yeah, this guy's okay. He's
2:21
he's kind of on my level." Again, Sargeras, one of the Titans, and at this point, the leader of the Burning Legion,
2:27
she and Xavius basically cooked up a way to to get a portal open so that demons
2:32
from the Burning Legion could come through. And most of the highborn sided with her, but some were like,
2:40
"Was that really the end till the demons?" Now I'm a little not so with you. Led by a guy named Dathramar, whose
2:47
nickname was the sun, the he who walks by day. Um, this later on became his
2:53
last name. Uh, he named himself Sunstrider. These highborn joined up
2:58
with the other other night elves to oppose Ashara and and Xavius and the
3:04
whole deal where the world was going to get destroyed by demons thanks to Illan uh Storm Range blowing up the the the
3:12
well of eternity and practically sinking most of Kalumdorf. They they suite they
3:19
succeeded in surviving what Ashara was going to do. Uh Xavius ended up a tree.
3:25
Sargeras ended up not being able to come through the portal. Uh things were I mean obviously a lot of people died and
3:31
a lot of bad stuff happened but at least the world didn't get eaten by demons. However, the highborn who were now very
3:39
very much isolated because the rest of their culture, the rest of the night els were like, "Yeah, we're going to ban
3:45
that that whole arcane magic thing. That's that stuff's bad. We shouldn't do that anymore." And they were like, "Hey,
3:50
it's not arcane magic's fault it was used like this." but they weren't getting listened to. So, finally, uh,
3:57
Dathramar and a few of his friends were like, "Okay, you know what we're going to do? We are going to use our magic to
4:02
create an the biggest storm possible to get everyone to pay attention to us and
4:07
understand that, you know, arcane magic is not to be feared." Similar to, oh, hey, they're afraid of us, so we're
4:13
going to punch them in the face. That'll that'll cure. And so, as I think anybody who was thinking clearly would have
4:19
understood, doing that upset the night elves who banished the highborn from
4:25
their society. Datamar and his his followers like, "We'll find them. We don't need you. We're going to we're going to go and we're going to make our
4:31
own kingdom. We'll play blackjack." Uh, and so they they got on boats and they
4:36
sailed across. And keep in mind, this was when the the continent had just recently gone through the whole sundering. They didn't know what they
4:43
were going to find when they got on the boats. They had no idea what was out there. They were just like, "Well, you know what? We we have to use magic. We
4:50
can't we can't cope with this. So, we're going to go." They ended up sailing across. They they managed to avoid the
4:55
maelstrom, which is act at the time that was an accomplishment. And they ended up landing on what is now what we call uh
5:02
Terrace Fall, the Terrace Fall Glades. They they basically got off their boats,
5:08
set up an encampment, and within a couple of weeks, they were like, "No, we are out of here. We are not staying. We
5:14
keep having horrible dreams. This place is cursed. And they didn't know it, but it's because one of the servants of the
5:21
old gods, Zakaz, was buried in Tyrus Fall. They they were picking up on it.
5:26
So, they got out of dodge, moved halfway across what was they were in currently in what's now the Eastern Kingdoms. They
5:32
moved until they hit a big forest up north. And the only problem that big forest had was that there were some
5:37
trolls there. Now, they were Ammani trolls. They they thought themselves extremely powerful. They were dominating
5:43
this entire the entire north of the Eastern Kingdoms was under their control. But the uh then still calling
5:51
themselves highborn had magical ability in like you know to just tons of it.
5:57
They were incredibly magically gifted. They carved their way through what was then the the troll dominion pushing them
6:03
to what is now Zulan. That was where they were left. They had that hold out. Everything else became the highborn.
6:10
They moved up and created the Sunwell. Uh Dathramar had some water from the
6:15
original well of eternity given to him by Illodon and he used it. Uh he c he
6:20
did his own magic as well. The Sunwell wasn't just another well of eternity. It was altered by Damar in a ritual to tie
6:28
it to the power of the sun. And that's when his people begin to change physic. And that's when these we we can say that
6:35
the highborn stop and the high elves begin. I'm going to skip over a lot of stuff
6:40
here because we'd be here all day. But the after many many years, the highborn
6:48
who are now high elves allied with humans during the the horde uh invasion
6:54
because of an old pact that they had signed with the humans when the humans helped the high elves during the troll
7:01
war. So they basically fought uh Zuljen during the first war and as a result
7:08
they had the orcs and the uh trolls both fighting them. As a result of this most
7:13
of the Windrunner family got killed. Put a pin in that. We're coming back to it. Uh Dramar's son Anastion was now king
7:21
and he had been king for a very long time at this point. Um, Asterion's son,
7:26
Kalethos, went to Dalerin to study magic where he met Jana Proudmore. Uh, he fell
7:32
in love with her. She was like, "That dude is like way older than me. This is a little creepy." Uh, so she never
7:39
reciprocated and he didn't actually pursue her. It was very much just like
7:44
he would stare at her and think, you know, oh god, she saw it. But he wouldn't he wouldn't do anything. Um
7:50
this led to him being involved sort of against his like will in the events of
7:56
Warcraft 3. uh Kilthas was just in Derin and suddenly all this stuff was
8:01
happening and Dererin got messed up and when he was trying to react for that he
8:07
found out that the thing that that Arthus did before he came to Dererin and messed it up was he destroyed the
8:14
Sunwell polluted it in order to raise somebody necroantically effectively
8:19
destroyed Keelthos's home when Kalethos heard this he immediately went back to
8:25
12thos found the those he could find, the survivors, which he this wasn't a
8:31
decimation. He didn't this wasn't a they didn't lose one/tenth. They only had
8:36
onetenth left when they got there. Like most 9/10en of the high elves were dead.
8:43
um of the survivors. He basically gathered as many as he could which was
8:48
around 9/10en of the survivors and talked he gave his famous speech about
8:54
becoming something else to honor the dead that they had lost and they called
8:59
themselves now the blood elves to to to honor the blood shed during the invasion of the scourge in the third war. That
9:06
led up to the modern the modern period for the the blood elves. They were
9:12
independent for a while. Um, Kthas of course went to Outland ultimately al you
9:18
know ended up teaming up with Idon and uh, you know, of course Lady Vos and he was doing all that for looking for a
9:24
cure for his people. When the Dreni came to Outland, Kaleth took an interest in
9:30
them and specifically the ships they were using to they they used to get there because they a whole bunch of them
9:35
just showed up. There were some there already obviously uh but he the ones that showed up uh to to save Ellen um
9:43
them he was like what what's the deal with those? So he invaded and he met
9:49
Anaru. He didn't just meet the Naru. He sent the Naru to um to uh Ke I want to
9:57
say Kelas and it's it's Qualos. Um he sent the the Naru. It was Muru, right?
10:02
I'm not wrong about this, am I? Muru. Yeah, he sent Muru to Quilos and
10:08
basically said, "Here you go. This is my buddy Haldderon. He's transporting this guy to you. Howeron knows me and knows
10:15
I'm cool. Uh, you guys can use this to kind of, you know, it's a power source. You can use it to alleviate, you know,
10:22
the magical addiction that's been driving us all crazy ever since the Sunwell got destroyed." Howeron talked
10:28
to Ranger Lord uh Loramtheran and alongside uh a former high elf priest
10:35
who had become a blood elf but had lost her connection to the light because she just didn't believe in it anymore. Um
10:42
they created the blood knights and in the process of doing this they were using Muru's power. First they were
10:47
using it against his will but the thing is is they were never actually using it against his will because Muru had seen
10:53
all this coming. He'd seen Keelthos coming. He knew what was going to happen. He deliberately stayed in
10:59
Tempest Keep to get grabbed. Like he knew his future, all of it, all the way
11:05
to the end. And when Kalethos finally lost it and started just straight up
11:11
working for the Burning Legion because he didn't believe Idon's promises anymore, had the ability to cure the
11:18
blood elves of their magical addiction, but he was saving it. He wasn't using it to do that. He told Kalethos he would
11:24
and then he didn't. He had reasons for that uh because he knew the legion was much bigger and more powerful than
11:31
anybody suspected and he knew Sargeras was still out there and was going to come back. So he was trying to hold on
11:36
to that power for as long as possible before he used it. Keto just saw that
11:41
was just not doing what he'd said he'd do. He'd already seen betray um his deal
11:47
with um I want to say Kelazad, but it's not Kelazad. I'm having a trouble with names today.
11:53
uh Kill Jaden. Uh he'd already seen Ilan betray Kill Jaden. He knew that Ilanon
11:58
didn't really care if he if he lied to people's faces. So, he decided, "Nope, Kill Jaden makes a lot of sense. I'm
12:05
liking I'm liking the things he's telling me. I'm going to go with Kill Jaden. I'm going to work for Kill Jaden." And he went and basically when
12:12
that happened and the the Tempest Keep got raided by a party of adventurers, he
12:18
almost got killed. He he got really badly injured and he ended up retreating
12:23
to the Magister Sanctum at the Sunwell Plateau after he helped steal Muru from
12:29
from Quelos. And when he did that, he basically took all the hope that the the night el the
12:36
blood elves were feeling and stole it from them and they were like destroyed. Even Haldan who was besties with Kelas
12:43
was like I can't believe he did that. He he he took Maru from us. He he gave him
12:49
to us and they took him away. Why would he do that? And so even Haldderon was starting to turn on Kas. Leadron went to
12:56
Shetrath city in Outland and basically threw herself at the feet of the Naru
13:02
there. Um I want to say a doll. They all have names. Uh threw herself at a doll's feet and said, "You know, I you know, I
13:08
know what we did was horrible, but my people, please." And he's like, "Oh, no." He knew Muru knew you were going to take him. Muru knew this was all going
13:14
to happen. He did it on purpose. We you know the whole point is to help you to
13:20
save you from where you're going. you were going down a dark path. uh just because your your regent I mean you know
13:26
your prince has has tithed to he tied himself to the legion you don't have to
13:31
do that you can be saved and so the whole Sunwell offensive thing gets formed and it's both uh blood elves and
13:38
Dranai at this point which is like these two groups are working together but they did and they successfully went into
13:44
Magister's Terrace and ganked Kalethos again this time apparently for real because he shows up later on in the
13:50
Shadowlands they then go to the Sunwell Well, and essentially through a whole
13:55
bunch of shenanigans involving Anvina, who is in fact the Sunwell this whole time, uh, and kill Jaden coming back,
14:02
they purify the Sunwell with Muru's remains. I mean, calling it remains
14:08
seems to mean, yeah, his essence, what was left of of Muru after Muru went all voidy. uh he went back to being Muru the
14:15
light thing, but they they put him in the Sunwell and turned the Sunwell into a new kind of font of power that drew
14:21
directly from the Holy Light. And that was kind of where things have been standing. They joined the Horde while
14:28
this was all going on. So, at this point, they were in the Horde, and there's been a bunch of stuff back and
14:33
forth. Uh, Loramtheran married uh, Thelissa from the nightborn and now they
14:39
kind of have like a twocity household where some like he's usually in uh, Kelos running that, she's off in
14:47
Oh, yeah. Silver Moon. He's all in he's in Silver Moon running that and she's the one in uh, Suramar running that.
14:53
So, yeah, that's that's a Reader's Digest version. I know this stuff I left
14:59
out. Yeah, that that is a very very very brief version of uh
15:05
be here all day. How the blood elos got here. Uh and I think we're going to take some tidbits from there and talk a little bit more
15:11
specifically about them because there are some notable uh blood elves or you
15:17
know folks from this history that may make an appearance uh in here. In fact, we know two of them and we'll we'll talk
15:24
with the two we know about for sure. Uh first is Lothamar Theon. So, Lithamar
15:30
uh is the regent lord of Qualos. Uh he is technically, and I'm an air quote
15:35
ruler of the blood elves. Uh basically, he's the more their mouthpiece than anything else. Uh he tends to represent
15:42
their interests more than act in accordance to like what a king or another ruler would be. There were many
15:49
that asked for him to step up and become the king. Uh and he refuses. it's not
15:54
his idea uh or his ideal way to help his people. Um in terms of looking back like
16:02
he's lived through he lived through essentially one terrible monarchy, a
16:08
series of wars and bad decisions. He's seen what happened to his people when
16:13
they were not considered. Um, and despite Kel Thas saying that he did it
16:18
for his people, most of the decisions he made were relatively selfish uh in the
16:24
the heat of the moment. Um, he's better now now that he's dead. Selfish or short? Selfish or short? Shortsighted. Yeah. Um, he's better now
16:31
that he's dead and has had time to reflect upon his sins, but that's a whole other story. We'll get back to it at some some other point. Um, he is
16:40
essentially he is a king and all, but he cares about his people.
16:46
He wants to do the best for them. He makes sure that they are welldefended uh
16:52
as much as possible and he is uh a very large diplomatic force uh when dealing
16:59
with both the horde and the alliance. Uh when we sieged Ormar, he was right there
17:05
with us. uh when we sieged uh you know the the the wonderful world of the
17:12
Broken Isles uh he was there as well uh front and center not afraid to get his
17:18
hands dirty because again he remembers the scourge invasion he was there uh I
17:25
believe that I don't know if I remember if that's where he got his his eye taken or if I don't remember either.
17:30
I can't remember where that happened. Um the first time I saw him was in the uh comic the manga.
17:36
Yes. and he didn't have it then. So, and he also went through all of this as
17:42
the second in command to Ranger General Sylvanas Windrunner who yes, she was the
17:48
ranger general of Silver. Uh so, he is a very important figure. He is somebody
17:53
who has dealt with uh so many different things and all the different aspects of
18:00
uh blood elf life. And I'm like I'm skipping so much because he's just such
18:06
a he's a very complex but very I feel underutilized character that the first
18:13
time we're seeing him is in Defense of the Sunwell and we haven't seen him in quite a long time. Uh, but he is a
18:19
brilliant tactician, a brilliant statesman, and I mean, he got to get
18:24
married and actually have a wedding, uh, where, you know, most of the folks in in World of Warcraft that are NPCs that
18:31
decide to fall in love, uh, usually their relationship gets fridge somehow. Uh, so he's made it out of there. But
18:37
again, he is he represents a more modern view of blood elf society, right? He
18:44
doesn't hate magic, but he doesn't want to rely on it. He doesn't you know think that everything in suns and sunshine and
18:51
roses. He understands the reality that faces his. He h tries to advocate for
18:57
them amongst the other members of the horde and now the members of the alliance and very likely in the very
19:03
near future probably on uh behalf of him his people to all elves at Bellamath
19:11
uh when all the elves is eventually convene because it does seem like we are getting to that direction. Um I'm
19:17
probably missing a bunch of stuff with him. Uh, so I mean feel free feel free to feel free to add some tidbits.
19:23
Well, I mean one of the things about Loramar is not only was he Sylvanas's like right hand um I guess he was more
19:30
like her right hand and then Nathanos was her left hand. Um he's also really close uh to her
19:38
sister um Yria. he, you know, Yo was going to be, you know, the ranger general and
19:46
then refused it to go fight against the orcs directly. Um, so he knew her quite
19:51
well and Verissa served under him, you know, during the the time period in which Sylvanas was ranger general.
19:58
Verissa would almost always report to him, not to her because it was be kind
20:04
of weird if you were constantly going to your sister to get orders. Um, this way by having it be um, Loramar, it
20:11
prevented that kind of problem. So, he knows the the Windrunner family. Um,
20:17
which I think is going to be important for another character that we're pretty sure we're going to see based on the fact that he's got some quests.
20:23
Oh, yeah. Um, also I I would also point out like during the during all of that as well,
20:29
um, I I I remember it was what during the second war when uh the Dragon Ball
20:35
clan invaded and you have Lothar showing up and then meeting with Yari and
20:40
Tellion and getting like he's one of the few Horde members that like Telion
20:46
actually respects it with not just because of because of like his selfless
20:52
actions and his willingness to, you know, defend the the the weak and innocent. Like it that doesn't it's not
20:59
exactly a uh they're not friends if they respect each other, but it is a respect. Yeah. Uh which I
21:05
think is actually really really important here because in the future of what's coming, we know that Terellion is
21:11
going to be around, right? He he's the army of the light's coming. they're going to be involved in defending the
21:16
Sunwell and sort of that mutual respect that they have between uh them between
21:22
Terellion and Loamar is going to be an important factor moving forward. And
21:27
again, oh, one other thing I I need to throw in here really fast. I was saying Huran that whole time. I meant Ramath,
21:33
the guy who brought uh Muru to the to the uh the blood elves was Grand Mister
21:39
Ramath. Howd and Brightblade is current ranger general of Silver Moon and he's uh Loramar's best friend
21:46
and he will be our best friend in the he'll be our best friend very shortly in the expansion. Yeah. And also he he is the one that uh
21:54
he knew Verissa better than Loramar did. Yeah. Let's and were very close. Let's talk about Heldron a little bit.
22:00
Let's because I think that's a natural transition. So we're going to be seeing him. He is the the ranger general, current ranger general. But I mean, what
22:07
other things of notice has he done besides, you know, serve with Sylvanas and Verissa? I mean, and of course, Lortoar, but he
22:13
he also he's very involved in the whole deal with the Sunwell. Um, when the Sunwell got destroyed and then it turned
22:20
out that the Sunwell was in fact now a human girl. Um, Howderon, who who'd also
22:27
fought in the Second War, um, keep in mind in Herderon actually fought directly against the Ammani trolls.
22:33
Oh, yeah. and and uh Howler was one of the people like alongside Loramar, he
22:39
was one of the people who was recruited by Yria when she was mobilizing the forces to fight against the uh the
22:48
Ammani and uh he she's the one who brought uh she's the one that basically introduced Howder and Loramar to
22:55
Sylvanas and that's why they were all tight with Sylvanas. Um they fought
23:00
against the orcs and then they fought against the Ammani. Howtheron might have been there when Zuljian got his his eye
23:06
taken out cuz Howtheron's one of the the of the the blood elves who you see back
23:11
when he was a high elf capturing Zulon. That that's him. He's one of the people who's there.
23:17
Yeah. So yeah, he if you Zjen went through some stuff and Howderon might have been
23:22
one of the people doing it. So that's important. Uh I I don't know if they're going to deal with that. I don't and I
23:27
certainly don't know h how muchon would regret that quite frankly. the Ammani
23:33
trolls spent a lot of time messing with the uh the high elves who then became
23:38
the blood elves. I don't think's that likely to care, but he was also involved
23:44
in the whole deal with um Darandra trying to capture Envina to gain the
23:51
power of the Sun. Well, you know, Hderan's the the main Farst rider who
23:56
was there and it's it's Howerin's Hder brought Howerin confronted Sylvanas at
24:03
that time and that they ended up working together. Like he's like, "You have to get out. You can't be here. You we don't
24:09
trust you." And she basically just kind of looked at him and said, "How come on?" And he's like, "Yeah, you're
24:14
right." And then they worked together. Um, so it's possibly Hder who is
24:20
responsible for Sylvanas inviting the blood elves to join the Horde because
24:26
Huran's contact with her was peaceful and she was surprised by that. Howan
24:33
didn't reject her because she was Scourge. I mean, he didn't like that she was Scourge and and of course obviously
24:40
wasn't Scourge Scourge anymore. She was forsaken. But to him when he met her, he didn't know that there were two different factions of undead. He just
24:46
saw a scourge there. But he still listened to her. He still gave her that
24:52
chance. In a real way, I think Halder is one of the few people on Azeroth who
24:58
could be trusted to be neutral in dealing with a return Sylvanas. Yeah. And I think he would make his own
25:04
decisions on that. And I think that's important because and and there's a couple other characters we're going to talk about, but I am going to move over
25:10
to Sylvanas real quick. And the reason being is we we know and we have
25:16
confirmation that we have not seen the last of her that her story is not done.
25:22
We don't really have much more than that because that was during a dev interview at the reveal of Midnight. Um we don't
25:27
have any like explicit details beyond that because they really aren't allowed to talk about the story so far. But
25:33
there's a really, really good chance that all three Windrunner sisters are
25:38
going to converge back at Silver Moon. I mean, it is the ancestral home of their people. Sylvanas has a lot to atone for,
25:47
but there is one thing that she has always been very keen on, and that is
25:52
saving her people. uh she has and I think that in this particular case I
25:58
think Helderon is going to be the one most likely to extend the hand because
26:04
her sisters don't trust her or they they know her. They know what happened to her. Um Lothar is absolutely not going
26:11
to trust her, at least not at first. Uh and with good reason. He has every reason not to. Uh Lady Leand is not
26:19
going to which we'll talk about her in a few. Not going to trust Sylvanas. Sylvanas is still anthemma to her uh
26:26
what she stands for and honestly represents again like the a a dark time
26:33
for their people. But Heldron I think you're right. I think he'd be capable of looking at it maybe not neutral is not
26:39
the the best way to say he's willing he would be willing to listen. He would be objective about it. Yeah.
26:46
Yeah. He's not going to throw his people under a bus for her, but he is willing
26:51
to let her talk before he makes a decision. He did it the last time. He'd do it again because I I want to say this
26:58
about Helder, unlike Loramar, who is kind of tortured by having to be uh the
27:04
the the regent. Uh he doesn't like it. It it's kind of a pain for him to have
27:09
to step into that role. He sees himself as a military man. He's not a politician. He's not a king and never
27:15
wants to be despite being very good at it. Yeah, is absolutely where he wants to
27:21
be. Howdan loves being ranger general. Huran when the silver covenant showed up
27:28
outside Zulon. Huran worked with Verissa immediately. He didn't have any trouble
27:33
with it. And he straight up told the messenger who came to ask him about it that if Loramar had a problem with it,
27:39
he could come talk to him directly. So, he's not afraid to tell Loramar when to get seated because a they're they're
27:46
best friends. He never speaks to Loramar with disrespect, but he also won't be spoken to with
27:52
disrespect and he knows he's earned the respect. In a way, Howerin is the best
27:58
adjusted of any of the people we're going to talk about. Oh, 100%. He got where he wanted to be. He does
28:04
things the way he believes they should be done. He's never reactionary. He
28:09
knows that high elves are still his people even though he's a blood elf. He he doesn't he is in very in in very real
28:18
ways he is possibly the most comfortable in his skin of any of the people we're going to talk about.
28:23
And at the same time he is willing to to take help which I think that right there
28:29
I think that's the important bit too because it's that pragmatism. He like you said he's right where he needs to
28:35
be. He is he's a rager general for a reason. And it's not just because Loar doesn't want the title anymore. Um and
28:42
it's not just because the Windr Runners are off oft off in weird various corners of the universe.
28:47
No, absolutely. He is he is the best candidate. He is the best candidate. He has earned that role. and if there was somebody
28:54
better and as he's proven in the past with like uh Valyri sorry
29:00
he's willing to like you know follow the rule the law like somebody stronger than him or better suited for it absolutely
29:07
but and to the point where if somebody has a better idea how Duran will listen to it and go okay that's a good idea we'll do
29:14
that but in their darkest hour if if Sylvanas's Windrunner comes over the cresting hill with a bunch of dark
29:21
rangers with her and Remember, the dark rangers are blood elves, caldori.
29:28
Uh they they are elves that were raised into banshees, then shoved back into their bodies. They're still their
29:35
people. We've already seen them accepted into Bellamath at least somewhat. We
29:40
don't know the full extent of it cuz we haven't really gotten that far into like that reintegration, but there's a whole thing where you stay around and they
29:46
talk about I can't believe they let us back here. It this this feels good but weird. like I'm paraphrasing, but like
29:53
there's a bunch of like you know the the dark hunters that that that you can you can go and see that with. But if if she
30:00
shows up with a an army of of some of the most skilled uh warriors to die in
30:07
battle and then be raised into a more durable form, he's not going to say no
30:12
if they're fighting on his side. and he may tell other people to stuff it until they're all alive and, you know, dealing
30:19
with cleanup, then they can go have their petty squables. But right now, every arrow in an enemy is an is a one
30:25
life we save in Silver Moon. I can absolutely see him being that. And the I can too. Yeah, that makes perfect
30:31
sense. And the other thing I think with it too is it makes it important because if all three sisters are reunited, he may
30:38
actually wind up being the voice of reason, right? like the he knows all three of them so well that he
30:46
more so even than Loramar he's worked with all three of them for extended periods for extended periods in the field at long periods of time like he he would be
30:53
the perfect one to tell them all to shut up because he again as yeah I could have
30:59
something going excuse me um not to interrupt you it's all very fascinating we have that over there that we have to
31:07
stop the evil knife person who's in a corpse and all the the the shadowy
31:12
things. I I I table why don't I I my vote is we table this whole discussion
31:18
until they're not there. Now the cuz that's my dad. The other interesting thing that I think
31:23
would be possible that we would see that it's not a blood elf coming back is if Sylvanas and the dark rangers do come
31:31
back or do make an appearance to help save Silver Moon City. I can't imagine that if she's in the mall, she would not
31:38
have gone hunting for Nathanos's piece of soul. And if Nathanos were to come back, pretty much everybody would hate
31:44
him. But I also think Howderon would be like, "Can you still fire an arrow?" All right. Yeah. I mean, how of all of them was
31:51
never particularly negative towards Nathanos. No, he didn't care. He's like He's like
31:56
Loramar was negative towards him. Yeah. Lord, King Anisterian was Yeah. King Anisterian. Here's the thing, and we'll
32:02
just be upfront with this just so as good as Loramar was as a ranger,
32:08
purely as a ranger, Nathanos was better. Nathanos was better than any of them except maybe Sylvanas, who was the
32:16
acknowledged best of her. Let's let's also make a point here in the stories, if you read them, he was
32:22
better than Yria. Mhm. Like straight up, no contest.
32:27
So, it didn't even it wasn't even a thing. Now the other thing that I think is fascinating is because we talked about
32:33
Kel Thas a little bit as well and I want to come back to him here too. When we were in Shadowlands we learned that
32:39
Kalas was essentially being treated as one of the old reliables. Somebody who
32:46
uh wore their sins with, you know, and would not let go of them with a weird
32:52
exception. When we start going through and doing the encounter, you might think it's pride. pride that that that's his
32:59
sin that he can't let go of. And it's really not that. It's guilt. It's guilt
33:06
at his failures, guilt at letting his people down, guilt at not being the king that they needed or the prince, uh not
33:14
being able to see clearly, being clouded in judgment, all leading to the destruction or at least in his mind, the
33:22
near destruction of his people multiple times. But now that we get to spend time
33:27
with him in the MA, if you are doing the quest lines with him, you're walking
33:33
that back a little bit and he's starting to unravel his trauma. And he's still in
33:40
the Shadowlands. But there's something that I think has been very interesting this expansion, especially as we've in
33:47
the War Within, as we've learned about the Atherealss and the Brokers, they can take things out of the Shadowland.
33:53
Yeah. They have a straight up portal into it. They can take that's theirs. They can take things out of the Shadowlands that aren't necessarily
34:00
supposed to be taken out of the Shadowland. There's an even chance that Kale Thos makes an appearance as well in
34:07
the Defense of the Sunwell. And it may not be initial, it may not be up front, it may be one of the crescendo moments
34:12
midway through the expansion, but I could absolutely see Kelas making an
34:18
appearance, looking at Lothar nodding and just
34:23
blowing stuff up with his amped magic because as powerful as he was when he
34:29
was alive, he's more powerful now that he's dead. Dude is purema and he knows
34:35
how to wield it. ending. I mean, quite frankly, it might be the only situation wherein you could end up
34:42
with Loram Arthuron as the king of the blood elves because we all know that the
34:48
real reason he's holding himself back isn't all the other stuff he says is good and true and all that. The real
34:54
reason is he just doesn't think he's Yeah. He's not He's not royalty. He's not even
34:59
He's not even a mage. No, he was not He was not even a noble family, right? Like not even part of the nobility.
35:05
Yeah. He was just a soldier. And the the the the s the uh sun the
35:12
Sunstrider legacy, the Sunstrider bloodline has ruled since the first king
35:19
and they've only had two kings and one prince. It was only those three people
35:24
ever ruled them. And Inisterion wasn't bad. He wasn't a bad king, but he was inflexible and and dogmatic. And then
35:33
when he when he died, he died because he ultimately was just too stubborn to listen to people who knew better about
35:38
these specific things that were happening. Um, and then of course, Kalethos comes up. Kelas had never expected to take the throne for another
35:46
for several thousand years. He did not think he's his father was was perfectly healthy. There was no reason.
35:52
He had time for for a blood elf. Kilthas was fairly young. like he's obviously
35:57
many like at least a thousand years older than Jana, but for a blood elf, he was considered wet behind the ears. I
36:04
mean for at the time for a high elf. Um when he declared the blood elves when
36:09
he, you know, he created the new culture, everybody put him up on a pedestal that he had no idea how to be on like nobody had, you know, the only
36:16
person who ever had to do anything like this with Dramar. And how did he do it? He got on a boat. Gas didn't have the
36:23
luxury of just putting everybody on a boat and sailing away. Where were they going to sail to? Kalindor. They gonna
36:28
try it again like you know. So in a lot of ways I I think I could imagine Kthas
36:35
upon seeing Loramar he would if they had a conversation if they did had more than just a nod or whatever. I could imagine
36:42
him going you know you think you're not worthy but look at me. Look at what I did. Look at what I thought was the
36:49
right thing to do. You've done better than me just by not screwing up. You know, just the people need you. It
36:57
doesn't matter if you call yourself king or ranger lord or whatever. Lead them because that that's what you're doing.
37:04
That's your the role you have picked. And I know it's I know from personal experience how heavy it is. But you're
37:09
doing it already. So give yourself that. Don't keep saying you're not doing it
37:15
cuz you are and that's all that matters. There are people save them. You know, I could see that something like that. But
37:21
I could also just see him showing up, giving him a nod and leaving, you know, like maybe even not even coming fully
37:26
manifested, like he shows up as like this see-through phantom that just blows everything up and then just kind of just
37:31
looks at him and fades out. Um, that could totally happen. I I do think I would like to see Kas again. Um, he
37:38
hasn't been around in a couple expansions now, and I would definitely like to see more from him. And and along that same line, there's another one that
37:44
I think a lot of people will not think of that also ties in with Calos that
37:50
there is if we're pulling people out of the Shadowlands may also ride at the
37:55
side of of uh Sylvanas or possibly even Galthos and that's Lady Vos. Now,
38:02
everybody remembers her as a Naga, but she was a hibborn. She was a highborn in
38:09
service to uh our our our wonderful Azara and blood elves all started as
38:16
highborn and for a lot of them they existed at the same time she did and
38:22
I mean yeah go that's so true and I don't want to interrupt you but let's let's also keep in mind that Vos flirted
38:27
with him constantly. Yes, very much so. And she you could
38:32
tell she was doing it to discomfort him. But I could imagine her absolutely wanting to come back just to keep doing
38:39
it. Like I imagine in the Shadowlands right now, every so often she just shows up, torments Kalethos for a few minutes,
38:45
and then leaves just just to make herself feel better, you know, just like a little pickme up. Ah, here's Kaleth.
38:51
So, have you discovered that you can change your form yet? He's like, I I I
38:56
have not, Lady. Oh, well, you should look into that. He's turning purple.
39:01
Well, you know, so I'd like to see them. Yeah, absolutely. And the other reason I bring both of those up, too, is because there was one
39:08
important thing that they were doing at the end of Shadowlands that I think we may have forgotten about and haven't
39:14
talked about quite enough in uh the lore watch circles or possibly lore in general. What was the last thing they
39:20
were tasked with doing? Hunting dreadlords. And you cannot tell me that if the Dreadlords are still around and
39:26
unchecked that they are not going to be involved in something going on in Midnight at this point because it would
39:32
be an even bet that one of their one of them are going to show their faces. At least in my surmise.
39:37
Yeah, I mean I'd give it 50/50 odds. The only reason like lots of stuff could happen. We know it won't just because
39:44
not it can't all happen. You know, we it's you have to have a certain amount of time to get things out. Everything
39:50
that could possibly happen won't happen. But a lot of things are possible and that's one of the ones I think I'd give
39:56
an even 50/50 on the idea that the Nathism may show up. And then another person that we haven't really seen a lot
40:02
of uh but is relevant and I think is not a mistake that uh when we did the the
40:11
visions of N'oth uh was included as one of our companions when we were doing the
40:17
Stormwind side of things which is uh Valera Sanguinar and Valera Sanguinar is
40:23
a blood elf. She is she has survived quite a bit of things and she's an
40:29
independent person as far as that conc's not officially aligned with anybody. She
40:35
may be aligned more alliance than Horde these days, but her family was killed by
40:40
bandits. She survived the scourge. She grew up on her own, wound up being a pit
40:48
fighter at some point. Um, and is now essentially uh a confidant and I don't
40:55
want to say wet works. I don't really know that she's killed anybody on behalf of him. Uh, but she's very good friends
41:00
with the king of the uh the king of the humans, uh, the king of Stormwind, uh, our our wonderful little light boy who
41:07
just got his light bulb back. And I know I know you know. I'm just telling
41:12
people. um got a tandoin, man. You can't keep talking.
41:17
But she might also make an appearance because one of the things that I think is I think not really shown in the
41:25
combat situations of of Azeroth as often is that the services of an assassin and
41:30
a thief is often very beneficial in a war because they can get places you
41:37
can't. They can take out key pieces of leadership that you might not be able to get in a frontal assault. And even more
41:45
importantly, they can act as informants. And one of the things that I think is
41:50
going to be very important in the coming war and siege on the Sunwell is
41:55
information. And whether or not she wants to live in Silver Moon, they're
42:02
still elves. They're still her people. And there's a very good chance that she makes an appearance. Maybe not as
42:08
directly involved as some of the others, but I I'd give it an even shot. I don't
42:14
know how you feel about that one. Well, um there's actually another thing about that that that I've always there's
42:20
another Sanguinar. There's another blood elf named Sanguinar. Okay. And I don't know if he's still alive. Um
42:28
I don't even know if he's ever actually popped up in World of Warcraft, but he was a Warcraft character. And I would I
42:34
would actually like it if the reason the Alliance shows up to help cuz we know they're going to, you know, if you're
42:41
playing a if you're playing an Alliance character, you're still not you're still going to be going to Silver Moon. you're still going to be helping Dur. One of
42:47
the reasons that that might happen could just be Valyria straight up going to Anduin and saying, "Yeah, they don't
42:53
want they don't want to talk to you directly and make it look like, you know, they're trying to make you obligated or for that matter to get more
43:01
obligation cuz their their family and your family already kind of have a lot of that. But I'm kind of not asking to
43:10
I'm not asking you to come help us, but I'm not not asking you either because
43:16
she would be a really good back channel connection between the blood elves and
43:24
the alliance. She knows a lot of alliance people. uh she's got influence
43:29
because she's she was she was very close friends with uh with Varian Ren and now
43:34
she's close friends with his son. I I think that it would actually be a good
43:40
way to get the Alliance involved in this and also a good way to get her involved
43:45
in blood elf culture. She doesn't know much about being a blood elf. No. which I think is interesting because
43:51
I think her her her furthest ancestry that I think she was able to trace back was uh I think it's
43:58
Ralph Thra or something like that. It was a member of the uh the the order
44:03
that essentially uh the order of Cheersfall uh well and served actually
44:09
with Eguin uh I can never pronounce that name right. I'm sorry. uh when she was the guardian and I believe Valera s
44:17
found stuff that linked her to that uh to that as a very distant ancestor. So
44:23
her family has a history of being involved in very high-profile magic
44:28
confrontations. And I I looked it up because I I remembered that who it was. Lord
44:34
Sanguinar is one of the pe the four blood elves that's helping Kalethos
44:39
during the fight in Tempest Gate. That's right. So, I mean, he might be dead
44:46
uh canonically, but if he is, if Kalethos comes back, why can't he bring his four counselors with him?
44:54
That's true. Although, we don't know if that's just a household name, if there is actually like a relation relation
45:00
there or not. But yeah, that really interesting. Then again, for that matter, imagine if she
45:06
was just one of the servants of his family or her her family was. Uh there's
45:11
a lot of possibility there. He doesn't have to show up, but for that matter, they could just find out that she exists
45:17
and like, well, you're the last one alive that we know of. Welcome to to you're not now the you the lady of House
45:22
Sanguinar. And they'd be like, what? What House Sanguinar? I no one told me
45:28
about the house. There's just there is a lot of potential for Valyria Sanguinar. Valyria, not Valyria. Valy Sanguinar.
45:35
Uh, a lot of potential there. The fact that she's so entwined in a lot of stuff. Um, the fact that she doesn't
45:42
remember who Medan was. Uh, that's a joke, but come on, guys. Uh, you could have given me the Medan joke. Uh, yeah,
45:47
I honestly think it could be really Plus, she know she knew Merryill Firestorm there, and he actually cured her of of being infected by Fel. So, in
45:56
a weird sort of way, she's also got ties to like the the foresaken. Not that he's
46:01
a forsaken, but he does he does kind of do consulting work for them now. So, yeah, there there's a lot of lot of
46:07
little places she could end up. So, and and she's a blood elf. So, yeah. And the last one that I do want to talk
46:13
about is circling back to one we know is absolutely going to be there, which is Lady Leand. And I mean, the blood light,
46:21
the blood knight matriarch, the blood matriarch, or the lady of the light, whatever you want to call her, is
46:27
probably one of the most important figures that will be present here, that has honestly been sort of on the
46:34
sidelines for a while, mostly because while everything else has been going on for the last several expansions, she's
46:41
been guarding the Sunwell. Um, do you want to talk a little bit more specifically about her? Cuz she's she's
46:48
been around for a long time. Like her parents being slain by Ammani trolls.
46:53
Uh, she was a high priestess at one point if I remember correctly. Yep. She was uh basically the Audren's
46:59
family, as Joe just pointed out, was killed by Amani trolls, leaving her an orphan, and she was essentially taken in
47:04
by the high elf equivalent of the Church of Light. They had their own structures.
47:10
I was gonna say Vandalor. I remember that one. Yeah. And as a result of that
47:15
um she was very faithful like she she her entire life was built around the s
47:21
that you know being saved by the light being you know sheltered by the light. Uh so when the invasion of the scourge
47:28
came she was very committed to fighting it and she didn't think it was possible
47:34
that they could lose it because they had the light on their but they did lose. Now, we know they lost because of a of a
47:40
a traitor in the night the high elf ranks, but she didn't know that at the
47:45
time. She just knew that the light failed. Like she she was calling on the light as much as she could. She was praying to it
47:51
as much as she could and it failed and they their city fell. That's just from her perspective.
47:56
Yeah. And real quick, I just want to add in there like when we talk about the level of her devotion to the light. Uh
48:02
we talked about Zuljen ear earlier. Uh at one point in time uh Lothamar had
48:07
been captured by Zuljen. She used the light to turn back upon him. Every ounce
48:15
of pain that he had caused in order to create an opening to rescue Lothar. Just
48:22
a priest at this point. She was not a paladin yet. Like no, she was very much but she was very
48:28
devoted to her people. very um and her her fall, her collapse when
48:33
the city fell is is like emblematic of what so many of her people went through.
48:39
Uh if you lived, you were already like tortured just because you lived. And
48:46
keep in mind, she knew Drahand Drathier, the the the former high elf who was the
48:52
scourge um catpaw and later a member of the scourge. She knew him. She they were
48:58
the ones who went to the who got caught by the Ammani and saved Loram Martha on
49:05
like both of them were there. She knew that guy. She would not you know to find
49:10
out later that he was responsible. That's just another blow that she went through like you know our people died. I
49:17
didn't believe enough to save them. Again not true but that's how she felt. finding out that someone she knew had
49:24
been part of it had help actually helped the scourge destroy the Sunwell and
49:30
losing the Sunwell itself is just it's a big symbolic loss that she also went
49:36
through. Her king died, her people died, her city died, her faith died all in
49:42
like one go and she somehow managed to keep going. Um, and when she kept going
49:49
like, and keep in mind, she she actually fought in the second war. So, she actually fought during the first Horde
49:54
invasion. So, this wasn't her first time in a war either. Well, not only that, she she fought as
50:00
part of Helderron Brightwing's company. Yeah, she was she was basically like their priest. Um, so yeah, there's a lot
50:08
of She went through a ton. She survived so many things, but she just didn't like
50:14
she just couldn't let herself go. And she was enraged. Like she was actually angry at the light
50:22
because she kept calling on it and it kept like near the end when the Sunwell
50:28
got destroyed and polluted. She was calling on the light and it wasn't answering her because she was too upset
50:34
and too, you know, you too much PTSD, too much trauma for her to reach out to
50:40
it properly. She didn't know that. She just felt it it had abandoned her. Um so
50:46
when Kaleas shows up and now he hasn't actually directly come uh but when like
50:53
uh Ramath shows up with Muru and is like I have an idea based on what we've seen
50:59
these things do uh I want to create a new order. Leadron was the first
51:04
volunteer because it was 5 years after the uh the destruction of of Qualas and
51:10
she still felt guilty about the whole thing. She felt like it was all her fault. Now,
51:16
it obviously wasn't, but that's how she felt. And she was also undergoing the same problem that
51:23
all of the blood elves had. She was undergoing arcane addiction. Um, so she
51:29
was living out in the ghost lands. Uh, Ramoth showed up and basically said, "I
51:34
need people to help me do this." Um, she knew about Kaos and Idan working
51:40
together. She thought that was fine. uh anything to help their people. So when Ramath showed up and said, "You of all
51:47
people, you are the one I want to lead this order. You know war. You've been
51:53
through pain and suffering just like our everyone of our people. You will be the
51:59
face of this new order. You will be its leader. You will be its founder." And
52:04
she was like, "Okay, is this going to kill me?" He goes, "Probably. We have no idea what we're doing." And she's like,
52:10
"Okay." And so possibly through the sheer power of her need to atone,
52:17
possibly just due to the rage that she was feeling or possibly due to that really at her heart she still believed.
52:24
She still wanted to believe. She'd believed her whole life and the idea that she could somehow in some way
52:30
reclaim it. However it worked, she survived. She became the first blood knight. She became the one who when
52:37
Kalethos came and stole Muru and condemned her order and her people back
52:42
to the arcane addiction. She's the one that said, "I'm going to to Shatrath. I
52:48
don't care if I die. If they kill me there, fine, but I'm going to go and I'm going to say we need help." And she did.
52:55
Um and they were like, "No, yeah, come on in. We we were we've been hoping you'd show up. We've been waiting for
53:02
this." And in that moment, what Leaddin got and what she communicated to her
53:08
order and to her people was that they weren't beyond saving and that the very
53:15
per the very being that they were essentially using as a battery had always intended to bring the light back
53:20
to them. That he he had determined that his own death would be necessary to do
53:25
it and he decided to do it. And that since then her faith has been I won't
53:31
say it's been restored. It's kind of like the the whole bit in Lord of the Rings where the sword gets remade. Uh
53:37
Narcil becomes you know the new one the flame of the west. Uh it's kind of like that through that
53:44
process of becoming a a blood knight of coming to understand that none of this
53:50
was it wasn't a a case of them ripping the light from Muru and forcing him to
53:55
to aid them. He was giving himself to and that understanding and the new Sunwell that came out of it
54:03
kind of basically made her a new person. She was everyone she had been but now she was like if you took them all and
54:10
like hammered them like layer by layer like you were making a sword and you fold it over and over again to get out
54:15
any of the weaknesses or impurities. She's been hammered like she's been through everything. Leaddin is one of
54:22
the possibly strongest people. When when the Suramar campaign came, Leaddin was
54:28
basically the the fighting arm of the blood elves. She was in charge of that.
54:34
And she's the one who basically said, "We're not going to destroy the city. We're going to do our best to save these
54:40
people." Um, if not for Leadrin, Loramar never would have got to marry uh Thelissa because she would have been
54:45
dead. Um, yeah, Leaddin is as a paladin. She is a in a real way she's one of the
54:52
first I I don't want to say like a redemption arc, but it's close to it. Like she went from being like angry and
54:59
bitter and not believing in the light anymore to realizing no, no, it's it's
55:04
like what Villain at one point said to uh one of the the forgotten ones in the swamp. He goes, "The light doesn't
55:11
forget you. The light doesn't abandon you. It's it's not the light. the light just has, you know, the light isn't
55:17
unopposed and she realized the light didn't abandon her. It was her pain that
55:23
that made it impossible. You had to get through. It's actually of all people, I
55:28
think Leadrin could understand Anduin better than almost anyone. I would agree with that. And the the
55:34
fact that they haven't had a face to face, I think is tragic. Yeah. I think the two of them could
55:39
really understand each other. like I could imagine her, you know, talking to him and and he's he's explaining what
55:44
happened to him uh in in the uh Arai area and she'd be like, "Yes, I remember
55:51
when I finally realized that the light was always still there. Um that I that it was me that that it was my pain that
55:58
got in the way. It wasn't the light turning itself turning its back on me. The light doesn't turn its back on you." And that's, you know, those two I would
56:06
I would like it if they got time together. I don't think they're going to, but I know Leaddin's going to be in this expansion because she's in the
56:12
cinematic. They don't put you in the cinematic and then not have you there, you know. Um, yeah, she's going to be a key figure
56:17
going forward. And I think for me, the interesting thing is going to be to see the interactions that she's
56:22
going to have because she is a completely different person than she was. Um I the one other thing I do want
56:28
to end on before because we're we're sort of at time here is a we don't know
56:34
this for sure and this is a speculative point that a lot of people have uh coming to a conclusion is we haven't we
56:41
haven't really had a death yet that has been significant uh besides the
56:46
temporary loss of Khadgar really truly in the war within so and this this
56:52
trilogy and the thought or at least people are speculating that as This is the midpoint of the the trilogy. Uh and
57:02
thusly can be assumed to have some of the the highest crescendo moments that
57:08
we're going to lose somebody. And a lot of people are speculating that it's going to be somebody that is related to
57:14
the elves. Uh some folks are trying to claim that it'll be uh Sylvanas's last
57:19
haron. She'll get a final death. Um some folks are saying that it's going to be Lady Leandrin. uh or that it'll be
57:26
somewhere along the lines of uh possibly maybe Lormar themselves.
57:32
But I'm curious if you have any bets on it because I I have a bet uh or at least
57:38
I think I know who I think would be the most likely if it does happen. But I'm curious if you have somebody that you
57:44
would think would be the most impactful. Artor. Really? Yep. What's um our favorite knife been
57:52
trying to do since the beginning of the war within? Yeah, that's fair. She's been trying to
57:57
to get uh Valyria to
58:02
You're right. So many so many area names with these elves. Elves like that noise. Yeah. Uh trying to get her to
58:10
essentially become her. Yeah. And we've seen one future where
58:17
goes full void and what happened? Artor died. Well, she kills Artor or at least or at
58:23
least sacrifices them or gives them to N'oth. But it it's the loss of Arritor that
58:29
always breaks her. Um, since she had Arritor, he is essentially she has spent
58:34
a lot of time away from him because of the various wars she was involved in, but it also feels like she's
58:40
deliberately spent time away. Yeah. and and she thinks if she's around him, he'll die because what happened to
58:46
practically everybody else she was related to. Yeah. Um they died, including Sylvanas. You
58:53
know, she only has one sister left and that sister keeps getting herself in danger. So,
58:58
yeah, I know if she lost Arator, it would be like losing her family. All see, now you mentioned that and that
59:03
some folks have been bringing that up, too. Here's my thing. I think that the death is going to be caused by an
59:10
attempt on Artor's life. And I think it's going to be Haldderon that dies. And I'm not saying this because I want
59:16
him to die. I don't I don't I I want him to stick around. But his death would be
59:21
the most likely unifying cause to rally and fight back. At least as far as I am
59:27
concerned. Like we talked about him being the one that would most likely welcome those in. Uh but him welcoming
59:34
outsiders in or that that help from others isn't going to ease those tensions. There's still going to be
59:40
those rivalries. There's still going to be uh those those deep-seated mistrust that the the I can't trust you. I saw,
59:47
you know, you're not even alive anymore type or any of those debates. But if he's the one that dies, he's the one
59:54
they all respect. He's the center point. He's the one that they all trust or at
59:59
least have respect for. Right. And if he dies, he could be the
1:00:05
unifying death that they forget about their, you know, they finally let their
1:00:10
their their baggage go long enough to actually deal with the threat instead of
1:00:16
having a weird drama screaming moment uh like it was an MTV show in the '9s uh in
1:00:23
the middle of like Silver Moon. So, I mean, it could totally be like one of the situations where uh um she basically
1:00:31
kills she kills him thinking it will fracture them maybe because make sense. He's the he's the glue. If
1:00:38
you get rid of the glue, people aren't being glued together anymore. Not remembering that sentiment is often
1:00:44
stronger after you lose someone. When Salderin's dead, it's possible that they
1:00:50
everyone would do exactly what you said. They'd rally if only to try and kill her.
1:00:55
Yeah. Because she she kills Hderron. It's like you don't kill Aldderon. And Helderron who's like the one who managed to keep
1:01:01
being positive and friendly through the Second War, the third war, you know,
1:01:06
everything. Helderon's been the one guy who's like, "No, we can we can work together. You kill that guy." I mean,
1:01:12
yeah. So, who knows? It it is possible. I still I still think it might be Artor, though. Or at least an attempt will be
1:01:18
made on Artor for sure. Yeah. I I think that's that's I think you're right on that. I think that's a given. How that how that finishes will
1:01:24
uh but I think that's going to do it for today. Thank you for joining us on our our journey here and I do want to remind you that Blizzard Watch is made possible
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1:02:01
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keep the lights on. But I think that's going to do it for us this week, folks. We'll catch you next time. I'm kid.
1:02:18
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