Up next in 10
This week, Joe, Matt, and special guest Liz Harper read the newly released Diablo novel The Lost Horadrim by Matthew Kirby, and are here to share their thoughts. This is where I'd make a joke about that new book smell, but it's Diablo so I don't want to think about smelling anything. In terms of time, the book is set between the events of Diablo 3 and Diablo 4, though this spans several decades worth of time. The three core characters in the novel are familiar to Diablo fans: Tyrael, Lorath, and Donan. And oh, the hijinks these three wacky guys get up to on the way to Skovos!
The book serves to bridge the gaps, and flesh out characters we already know from Diablo while set against the setting for the next Diablo 4 expansion, Lord of Hatred. It explores how some of these characters might know each other and the places they're about to visit while on the hunt for Mephisto. Plus, any extra time with Tyrael is always a fun little romp. Ah, angels. What scheme will they come up with next time? Well, that's kind of what Lord of Hatred is going to explore. So if you want more Diablo lore, come stay awhile and listen.
Subscribe to Lore Watch in your podcast player for more video game lore:
RSS: https://feeds.acast.com/public/shows/6556539150cd070012089193
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/lore-watch-podcast/id1023224738
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1CIJRbwbEVQfCg8r94HCwO
Visit us at https://blizzardwatch.com for the latest news on Blizzard games, and don't forget to subscribe on Patreon to support our efforts! https://www.patreon.com/blizzardwatch
Discord: https://discord.gg/MY9p4d7t8U
Bluesky: @blizzardwatch.com
Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Please be aware that this podcast will
0:03
contain spoilers for the Diablo I novel,
0:05
The Lost Harodram by Matthew J. Kirby,
0:09
releasing on April 21st, 2026.
0:24
Hello and welcome to Lore Watch round
0:26
table free form discussion in your
0:27
favorite media. I'm your host, Joe Pres,
0:30
one of several lore focused folks from
0:31
Blizzard Watch, and I've got my
0:33
marvelous co-hosts with me today.
0:35
Joining me as always, raging as a
0:38
barbarian does against the cold and the
0:40
demonic hordes, Matt Rossy. How you
0:42
doing, Matt?
0:43
>> Apparently, my blood is really good at
0:45
repelling fairy.
0:46
>> Uh, that is a factual statement. Um, and
0:49
then joining us as always, wondering
0:52
where in the heck fire her Amazon are,
0:54
Liz Harper. How you doing, Liz? Still
0:56
wondering where those Amazon are, but
0:58
you know, I I had either a bear or a
1:00
druid visit my house this week. I'm not
1:03
sure which. And both would be kind of
1:05
concerning, frankly.
1:07
>> That's very true. Well, friends, uh we
1:09
are going to be talking about some
1:10
Diablo stuff today. In particular, we're
1:13
going to be discussing the new novel
1:16
written by Matthew J. Kirby, The Lost
1:19
Harajim, a tie-in for the new Lord of
1:22
Hat expansion coming out. very very
1:26
soon. At the time of this recording, I
1:28
think we have a little bit over a week,
1:30
maybe less than a week, somewhere in
1:31
that range. Um, but it's coming out very
1:34
very soon and we figured it was very
1:36
pertinent to talk about this
1:38
novelization.
1:39
Now, that said, if you have questions
1:41
about what we talk about here or if you
1:43
have any sort of questions for this or
1:44
any of our podcasts, I would like to
1:46
remind you that you can go ahead and
1:47
send those in to podcastardwatch.com.
1:50
We ask that you specify what show it's
1:52
for in the subject line as well as any
1:53
special pronunciation of your name. Uh
1:55
and then if you don't want to hit us up
1:57
on email, you can hit us up on Discord.
1:58
We have the Q and podcast question
1:59
channel open for everybody. Same rules
2:02
apply. And if you are a Patreon
2:04
subscriber, as an extra way of saying
2:05
thank you for helping us keep the lights
2:06
on, we have the Patreon Q and podcast
2:08
questions channel where we tend to look
2:10
there first uh for any of your questions
2:12
or show ideas. So with that, let's kind
2:16
of talk about the nature of this book.
2:19
The time frame of this is it is
2:21
essentially taking place between Diablo
2:24
III and Diablo II, which I don't think
2:27
we've had any other books that were
2:28
released that sort of bridge that gap,
2:29
do we?
2:30
>> Nope.
2:31
>> I No.
2:32
>> Yeah. And so in this case, it it's
2:34
following the story of the Harajim or
2:37
the rebuilt Harajim uh with you you know
2:41
Tyel and his human man. And I say that
2:44
like that because he's not quite the
2:47
human. He's the guy that doesn't really
2:48
know fully how to be human yet. Uh
2:51
traveling
2:51
>> working on it.
2:52
>> He's working on it. Traveling with
2:54
Laurath and Doran to sort of fix the
2:57
world. Uh the Harajum are sort of this
3:00
weird case where they're trying to
3:01
defeat evil and protect Sanctuary. Um
3:04
but how they do that is generally up in
3:06
the air. And nothing makes that more
3:08
apparent than the first chapters of this
3:10
book where for a little few guys got
3:12
this impression from it. Uh, and I think
3:14
this is very accurate, especially when
3:16
dealing with Lurath. They're just kind
3:17
of winging it. Uh, which felt very on
3:21
brand.
3:21
>> I mean, yeah, they're just it it feels
3:24
like Tyel founded the Harajum way way
3:28
way back, but now we've had Miel's
3:31
calling and there are just a lot fewer
3:36
people in Sanctuary than there were. And
3:38
the Harajum is three people. This is it.
3:43
It's such a small group. And it's like,
3:45
okay, you're you're here to defeat evil,
3:48
all three of you, and it's it's a huge,
3:52
daunting job when there's so many bad
3:54
things happening in Sanctuary. If you
3:56
played Diablo I in particular, it
3:59
expresses the world as a bleak place
4:03
where there is no hope in the world. So,
4:07
if your if your mission is to defend
4:09
Sanctuary from evil, it's like, okay, I
4:12
have a list. It's 10,000 pages long. Um,
4:16
so yeah, how do you how do you even
4:18
tackle that? How do you begin to meet
4:20
your goals?
4:21
>> Yeah, especially since like I I've
4:23
watched way too many Tik Toks, Tik Tok
4:26
videos, and uh Instagram reels recently
4:28
because all I could think of is one
4:30
point goes, I got three guys and that's
4:32
it.
4:35
Ageless Ageless Immortal Green New Guy
4:38
and Mr. Anger Pants.
4:40
>> And it's just like that's what you got
4:42
going off the the start of this is is
4:44
Laurath is the guy who's like,
4:46
>> you know, he used to be the young guy
4:48
who got recruited young and he had so
4:50
much optimism and now he's just mad. And
4:54
we get why, you know, the book is not,
4:57
you know, neither the book nor the game
4:59
holds back on why he would be angry, but
5:01
it's still that's that's what you get
5:03
when you we start this is he's he's in a
5:06
you know, let's just kill them. Let's
5:08
just find these guys and kill them.
5:09
>> Yeah. And
5:11
>> go ahead. I was going to say there I
5:12
think maybe we talk a little bit about
5:13
the characterization in the opening
5:15
chapters because really I don't know if
5:17
you guys felt the same way but for me
5:19
the opening chapters of the book really
5:21
felt like almost as if the author was
5:23
trying to like reintroduce people to who
5:28
Tyel Laurath and Donan were but in a
5:31
much more like stripped down way.
5:36
And I'm not saying this is a good or a
5:37
bad thing. Um, I think maybe I felt it
5:40
was a little too simplified because like
5:42
you said, Laurath was the angry man who
5:45
just, you know, had to get his anger out
5:47
whenever he can. And Don's like, I like
5:48
puzzles and Tio's like, I still don't
5:50
know how to eat. Like it was almost like
5:53
>> No, no, he knows how to eat. He just
5:54
forgets a lot.
5:56
>> That's fair.
5:57
>> Aless immortal being too neurode
5:59
divergent.
6:00
>> Yeah. But it it it it felt it it it felt
6:03
a little charact almost like character
6:05
caricaturesque at the beginning to me.
6:08
>> I wouldn't say caricature so much as I
6:10
feel like it was shortcutting.
6:11
>> Okay.
6:11
>> A lot. Um the way I looked at it when I
6:14
was reading it was basically the book is
6:17
attempting to to do the thing where you
6:19
get a setup that allows you to just drop
6:22
into these people and and kind of know
6:24
who they are. But unfortunately,
6:28
I felt like a like if we a lot of that
6:30
whole bit with Kingsport and the, you
6:34
know, the cult, like you could have
6:35
dropped the cult stuff entirely and just
6:37
started with them arriving at Kingsport.
6:39
>> You could, but I think the cult stuff is
6:41
>> had
6:42
all the same stuff though. You could
6:44
have had the cult be in Kingsport.
6:46
>> You could you know what? I'm just
6:48
>> So, let's let's let's backtrack. Let's
6:50
backtrack a little bit and explain that
6:51
because I think I think if we're going
6:53
to talk about that, I think that is is
6:54
sort of like important. So, the opening
6:55
sequence of the book is literally them
6:58
coming across a blood cult, which if
7:00
you've played Diablo II, you'll kind of
7:02
have an understanding of what it is.
7:04
This seems like this is a nod to the
7:06
rudimentary uh nature of the blood cult
7:10
at the time where they're these
7:12
cannibalistic or sacrificial people are
7:15
uh basically putting blood ruins on
7:17
themselves. They're they're in the
7:18
marshes, uh, the blood marshes, I think,
7:21
specifically, and are capturing people
7:24
from towns and and using them as fodder
7:26
for their rituals, and this is what they
7:29
come across. And I think that it's
7:31
important here at least to acknowledge
7:34
that in this moment in the story, I
7:36
think the reason this isn't in
7:37
King'sport is specifically to show the
7:42
fracture of the Herod because each of
7:45
these three at this point. So Laurath,
7:47
Donan, and and Tyel all have very
7:51
distinct personalities that sort of
7:53
either feed into or play against each
7:55
other. And nothing exemplifies that more
7:58
than Laurath dealing with an injustice
8:01
that is not necessarily demonic in
8:04
nature. Or at least that's what Tyial
8:06
says here. And I think that's a very
8:08
distinct, very deliberate choice, right?
8:11
To set them up against something that is
8:12
a cult that isn't demonic based or at
8:16
least he doesn't make the connection. We
8:19
as people have played the game would
8:20
probably link that with with Lilith
8:22
maybe uh because we've played Diablo I
8:25
but to them they haven't dealt with her
8:26
yet.
8:27
>> Not really.
8:28
>> I think that they use they used the
8:29
blood marsh and all that because they
8:31
wanted to actually link it to Diablo II.
8:34
>> Yeah. This is the bridge.
8:35
>> That's the place it's the place where
8:38
the the original Harajum hid the black
8:41
soul stone. It's the place where Laurath
8:44
saw everybody but himself and Tyel die.
8:47
It's the It's the place where Adria had
8:49
a lair and was it was very much an
8:52
important part of the whole mouth deal
8:56
which this the book gives you but it
8:59
gives you like little pieces. So I think
9:01
if you didn't play Diablo II you're not
9:03
really sure what's going on like to a
9:06
certain degree. Um and that bothered me
9:08
a little even though I obviously I have
9:10
played Diablo II so I knew what was
9:12
going on. I do feel like if you're
9:13
writing a tie-in book, uh you could have
9:15
spent a little bit more time dealing
9:17
with why you said it there. But that
9:19
being said, I I don't object to them
9:23
doing that in terms of the the you know,
9:25
expressing, you know, here each of these
9:27
people is off in their own direction.
9:29
The harajum is just as shattered as the
9:31
world. Nobody really knows what they're
9:33
doing. Um it's all crazy. And that's all
9:37
fine, but I still don't see why you
9:39
couldn't have just done that in
9:41
Kingsport. And and that's my my problem
9:43
with it was I felt like there was a lot
9:45
of book that didn't really have
9:48
>> like once it got to a certain point I I
9:50
thought the story was started moving
9:52
well
9:52
>> but up until that point I was not
9:56
feeling that it did what they wanted it
9:58
to do. That's that's that's all I'll
9:59
say. No, no, no. And I agree with you,
10:01
but I'm wondering if some of the
10:03
intention behind it because even when
10:04
you get to Kingsport, and I want to let
10:06
Liz talk here in a minute, but I just I
10:08
just want to get this out there because
10:10
my feeling was it felt like a deliberate
10:12
choice that everything they dealt with
10:14
from the blood marches all the way to
10:17
Kingsport was highlighting how cruel the
10:21
world has become. and Sanctuary was not
10:24
necessarily the friendliest of places to
10:27
begin with,
10:28
>> but
10:28
>> I definitely don't disagree with you
10:29
there.
10:29
>> Yeah, but after the Malfio Calling, I
10:31
think they were trying to use this as a
10:33
a good example of you don't need demons
10:36
for there to be monsters here. And I
10:38
think that I think that was kind of the
10:40
point that they were going for. And
10:42
having that happen in multiple locations
10:44
gives you the feeling that it's it's
10:46
more widespread than it is isolated to
10:49
like one specific region or one specific
10:52
city. So, I don't know if that was the
10:54
intent. I'm not the author, but that was
10:55
the vibe I got from it. Liz, I don't
10:57
know what you thought about it. I mean
10:58
it I I'm kind of with Matt here that I
11:01
think you could have started further
11:03
along into the story because I think the
11:05
really interesting part and maybe this
11:07
is just because I'm coming at this from
11:08
someone who has played a lot of Diablo.
11:10
Uh the interesting part is when we get
11:12
to Scopos and because that's the place
11:16
that as a Diablo fan you haven't seen
11:17
before. This is the place we don't know
11:19
a lot about and this is this is what we
11:22
want to learn about. this is going to
11:23
Scoas is what we want to do and there's
11:25
a fair amount of time before Scoas but I
11:27
think I think you're right too Joe that
11:30
they're kind of trying to give us a
11:32
setting and introduce things for people
11:36
who maybe haven't played Diablo II or
11:38
Diablo I maybe don't know that. Um, so
11:43
yeah, I I can see how how the kind of
11:45
beginning chapters had a purpose and a
11:48
necessity, but I still felt it's like
11:51
I'm I'm interested in Scobos. Let's
11:53
let's keep going. Let's get to Scoas.
11:56
>> And I think one of the other things that
11:57
I think was important too about the
11:58
setup is it also highlights the age of
12:01
the players, which I think is an
12:03
important factor because in this Donan
12:06
is the youngest out of all of them. He's
12:08
the newest recruit. legs. As Matt said,
12:11
he's the green one. Um, but he's also,
12:13
and I I I hesitate to say this, um, but
12:17
I can't think of a better description,
12:18
while he is magically accomplished and
12:20
is a member of the Harajum, he's still
12:23
very much the child of the group and has
12:25
a lot of that childlike wonder.
12:28
>> Yeah. And not just that, he has that
12:31
kind of the same way Nel was when we
12:33
meet her. And I think it's interesting
12:35
because in the game Diablo 4, Don even
12:38
says, "She reminds me of me
12:41
>> when he meets Nel and you don't you
12:43
don't get it because when you meet
12:44
Donan, he's a stuck up old guy and then
12:47
he goes through a horrible tragedy and
12:48
you know that's the personality that he
12:51
develops. But in this, yeah, he wants to
12:54
know everything. He's positive. He can
12:58
handle everything." That's why I again I
13:00
keep saying that I think Kingsport is
13:02
could have been the start point because
13:04
you get Donan's stuff starting in
13:06
Kingsport.
13:07
>> Before Kingsport you don't get much
13:08
Donan at all. He's just kind of there.
13:11
>> He's very much like yes Daddy Tyial
13:13
whatever you say Daddy Tyial
13:15
>> like. And I'm saying that because like
13:16
it literally is like a father and child.
13:18
Like that's what the relationship is
13:19
like red.
13:20
>> Yeah. And in Kingsport he starts showing
13:22
off that he is also kind of arrogant
13:24
just like Laurath is. he's learned from
13:27
Laurath, but unfortunately he's learned
13:29
some negative stuff from Lauras,
13:34
but I can I can outrun them through this
13:36
town that I've literally never been to,
13:39
>> you know? And you get the sense that in
13:41
when you his life in Guull, which is
13:44
where he's from, uh, it was very clearly
13:47
upended by what Malfield did. Uh, you
13:50
basically he lost his family, like his
13:53
whole family. He lost his parents. He
13:55
lost his his relatives. And he was on
13:58
the streets in a town where like at
14:00
least half the people were dead, if not
14:03
more. And they they they're very
14:04
specific to say that sometimes they feel
14:06
like it was nine and 10 died. And
14:09
sometimes it they don't know how many
14:11
people died. In some places it may have
14:13
been a lot more than others, but they
14:15
know
14:16
>> that a lot of people died. It just it
14:19
comes right out and says this. It's like
14:21
I've I've I've mentioned it before that
14:23
it feels like a fantasy version of the
14:24
Black Death.
14:25
>> Yeah.
14:26
>> Because death did that in Europe and
14:28
Asia. It killed whole populations,
14:30
swasts of people just gone. And what's
14:33
really I think what's good about the
14:35
Kingsport section, which I think I feel
14:37
is a little bit better than the part
14:39
where they're just out in in the in the
14:41
swamps. The good thing about the
14:42
Kingsport section is that with through
14:44
the character of the harbor master and
14:46
through other characters you meet, you
14:47
establish that they're not these people
14:49
aren't like demonic
14:52
>> and they're not out to to like destroy
14:54
the world. They just want to they just
14:57
want to hold on to what they've managed
14:58
to claw out and sometimes that makes
15:00
them worse because they'll do anything
15:03
to not end up like they were when it all
15:06
went down. The harbor master really
15:07
comes off to me as somebody who's not
15:10
personally malevolent but also not a
15:13
good person. Like the things that the
15:15
harbor master does and the things we
15:17
find out about later are really give us
15:20
a kind of Wilson Fiskesque from the
15:22
Daredevil show. Not necessarily the
15:24
comic version. The V Vincent Denaprio
15:26
version of of Wilson Fisk kind of gives
15:28
that sort of vibe. Just this person
15:30
who's like like I don't care what you
15:33
want. you can't have it because it it
15:36
risks what I have. And I felt like it
15:38
needed to be there because it comes into
15:40
the book later. But at the same time, I
15:42
felt like we could have had this whole
15:45
thing be where we find out about Laurath
15:47
having anger issues. And the fact that
15:50
Tyel has is like massively self-doubting
15:53
like he's looked at everything
15:56
>> and he doesn't he's like what? I didn't
15:59
accomplish my goal at all and I gave up
16:01
everything for it and now I the world is
16:03
like this and you know he knew Malio. He
16:07
was friends with Mal.
16:08
>> Mhm.
16:09
>> And now Malio killed 910 of humanity.
16:12
Yeah. Yeah. So I felt like there's there
16:14
was some strong stuff in this part but
16:16
it's mostly once we get to Kingsport.
16:18
And I also have one major thing that I
16:20
have got to mention once or I'm going to
16:22
pop.
16:24
Where the where the heck is the
16:26
Nephilim? It's only been a few years,
16:29
man.
16:29
>> Yeah. So,
16:30
>> why is Nephilim not there helping you?
16:32
There's never anything said about this.
16:34
>> Yeah. That that also struck me as a
16:36
little bit odd because we know that
16:39
during the time and and and this is
16:42
where I I take a little bit of
16:43
unbridgeidge with the book. And one of
16:45
my feelings about the book is that and
16:47
and I'm not I don't know, but a lot of
16:50
it came off as the author maybe didn't
16:54
know the source material as deeply as
16:56
one would hope. Um because again, like
16:59
you said, there's no reference to the
17:01
Nephilim. Or it could be that they were
17:03
told not to mention it for some reason.
17:06
>> Last of I think I think that
17:08
>> um I suspect there are gameplay reasons
17:11
not to tie the New woman to it. I I
17:14
suspect this ties it because looks like
17:15
the Nephilim was the main character in
17:17
the previous game. So what are you going
17:21
to do about that? People can't play them
17:23
in the new game. They aren't you're not
17:25
taking a player character and making
17:27
them an NPC in this future game. So you
17:30
have to
17:31
>> Huh.
17:32
>> Some of them did. They the the crusader
17:34
>> Joanna
17:35
>> Joanna Joanna was in the as an NPC.
17:38
>> I mean Joanna is a Heroes of the Storm
17:41
character.
17:42
>> Yeah, but she's That's
17:43
>> female crusader.
17:44
>> She in Heroes of the Storm, the crusader
17:47
in Diablo III was never named.
17:50
>> Okay.
17:51
>> So, I mean, I It's kind of a little It's
17:53
kind of a little Easter egg or a little
17:54
one-off, but
17:55
>> but then then you have Cassiopia or
17:58
Cassia or Cassia, who is the
18:01
>> also a Heroes of the Storm character,
18:03
>> which is also a key NPC in Diablo. Like,
18:06
it's it's a weird gray area. Like I know
18:08
what you're saying, but like it maybe
18:10
this is endemic of the Diablo franchise,
18:13
which maybe we're going to talk about
18:14
this at the end a little bit. Um
18:17
>> it's inconsistent at best right now.
18:20
>> Yeah.
18:20
>> And
18:21
>> sometimes they bring characters back to
18:22
use them as NPC the next game at some
18:24
point.
18:24
>> Like like when we went from Diablo I to
18:27
Diablo II, we had this huge thing, the
18:30
character in Diablo I, the dark wanderer
18:32
in Diablo II. That's not a spoiler. That
18:34
one's real old. And uh so you have this
18:38
really interesting continuation from one
18:40
to two that heavily heavily involves the
18:44
main character and the choice they made
18:45
at the end of Diablo 1 and how that
18:47
affects them moving into the future. But
18:50
in games since then we haven't had a
18:53
continuation like that. And I think
18:55
particularly three into four they aren't
18:58
using the nephilm at all. you know there
19:01
that is that is the past game and this
19:04
is
19:05
yeah I mean I don't I don't love it. I
19:08
do think we had back in Diablo II we had
19:11
a a character that was just incredibly
19:14
powerful so powerful they were calling
19:16
them the Nephilim and it's like you know
19:19
we we could use that power right now to
19:21
help improve and save sanctuary. So but
19:25
yes it's it's kind of completely written
19:27
off. It really is.
19:28
>> Yeah. The surprising thing for me, maybe
19:30
not necessarily that they didn't like go
19:32
deep into like the Nephilim as a like a
19:34
character in the story or anything like
19:36
that, it's the lack of even a mention of
19:38
it that is really strange to me. like e
19:41
even in passing like as they're talking
19:43
about the events cuz they do do this
19:44
like they're in the book like Laurath
19:47
and uh Tyial in particular cuz Laur is
19:50
haunted by the vision the the he's got
19:53
PTSD CP see CP PTSD after living through
19:58
what happened in Diablo II and
20:01
>> made perfect sense by the way
20:03
no shade on that was a good choice.
20:06
>> Um but I and I did enjoy that. I did
20:07
enjoy the fact that they're showing like
20:09
yes, this has real, you know, this
20:11
carries weight and trauma with it. Like
20:13
this is what happens. Um, the thing that
20:16
got me was like they didn't even mention
20:18
like they mentioned others that that
20:20
were at work during it, but not even a
20:23
mention of the supposed Nephilim like
20:26
just kind of struck me as odd. And I get
20:28
what you're saying, Liz. just like I
20:30
would have expected at least like an
20:31
acknowledgement of it when they're tying
20:33
so much back to the third game already.
20:36
>> But when you meet the you meet the
20:39
scoundrel companion in D4,
20:42
>> he mentions the person he used to hang
20:45
out with. It's like all I'm saying is
20:47
someone could have said Loras could have
20:49
been, "What about the Nephilim?" And
20:51
Jeriel could have said, "I haven't I
20:52
can't find them. I don't know where they
20:54
are." Boom.
20:55
>> Yeah. But but to Liz's point, there
20:57
there likely is a reason why they were
20:58
told not to do that.
21:00
>> And they probably that is that is my
21:02
guess. I we we do know that Blizzard has
21:05
guidelines for how books are written.
21:07
>> Oh yeah.
21:08
>> And you know, maybe that's just okay. We
21:10
aren't talking about the Nephilim. Maybe
21:12
that's maybe they themselves have plans
21:14
to do something with the Nephilim in the
21:16
future. We don't know. But um
21:19
>> I think you're also right that they want
21:20
to avoid the they want to avoid
21:22
confusing people with all the potential
21:25
who they played versus, you know, they
21:27
don't want to of them over the others.
21:29
>> No,
21:29
>> I get that. I understand it.
21:31
>> But again, I do I do think we we let's
21:32
go back to the the book and the story
21:34
here because like you said, it doesn't
21:35
really pick up until they they start
21:37
heading to uh Sco Isles. But when you
21:40
get to Kingsport, it really does paint
21:43
the picture of more specifically more
21:46
like Kingsport is a huge city. It's one
21:49
of the largest shipping like uh and and
21:52
port cities of the West Marches. And
21:56
that's the whole point of them going
21:57
there. And even that city has been
22:00
rocked so hard by what happened in the
22:04
events of Diablo III that people are
22:06
going hungry. It was always a place
22:08
known for lawlessness, but even now
22:11
it's, you know, it's even represented as
22:13
a even seedier, more volatile place than
22:16
it was, which
22:17
>> I mean, you guys might remember better
22:19
than me, but um there's a part in the
22:21
opening where they basically come right
22:23
out and say that the the person in
22:27
charge, the harbor master, is straight
22:29
up just a criminal.
22:31
>> Yes.
22:31
>> Who just runs the town because nobody
22:34
else could at this point. They didn't
22:36
have any government left.
22:37
>> Yeah. And they they even make it a point
22:38
when they when they wind up because
22:39
they're asking for passage to uh the
22:42
Scoville Isles, which is the scene, they
22:44
wind up going to an inn. Um they ask for
22:47
uh you know v a particular vintage of
22:50
wine only known to exist in the from the
22:53
Sco Isles. Uh causes this big thing
22:55
where like the record scratches and all
22:57
the sailors look at them and then the
22:59
bar contender gets really really nervous
23:01
about it. Um, and this is where you get
23:04
introduced to the the whole thing about
23:06
the harbor master and that the uh town
23:08
is under the control of the harbor
23:09
master. And it really establishes how
23:13
desperate humanity is because even the
23:17
harbor master, somebody who would have
23:18
just been focusing on crime and and
23:20
smuggling, is not just doing crime and
23:23
smuggling, they're also smuggling grain
23:25
in. are also, you know, trying to bring
23:27
stuff in to keep the town going and keep
23:29
the city safe despite the fact that they
23:32
are criminal because like you Matt
23:33
pointed out, there is no functioning
23:35
government. There is no and and again
23:37
Kingsport being a lawless place at the
23:40
best of times. It actually now has more
23:43
law than it did before, strangely
23:45
enough. Um, and that's when we get
23:48
>> they still have criminals. They still
23:49
have gangs as as Donan shows us, but
23:52
they're very much like, you do not push
23:55
this person past this point because you
23:57
won't get a trial. There's not going to
23:59
be any sort of due process, you're going
24:00
to die, and so everyone knows where they
24:03
stand. And it's it's kind of like
24:05
depressing.
24:06
>> And this is also Mad Maxish here.
24:08
>> And this is also where we're introduced
24:10
to the fourth character of the book that
24:11
that we're really going to be uh
24:13
probably most attached to. if you have
24:15
any sort of human emotion, which is
24:16
Keldon. Um, which is a drunkard of a sea
24:21
captain who has had his ship impounded
24:23
by the harbor master. Um, the crew then
24:27
decides to uh help him get his ship
24:31
back. In exchange, he will take them to
24:32
the Sco Isles. Um, hilarity ensues. Uh,
24:37
and by hilarity, I mean they burn down a
24:39
barn on the harbor master's property. Uh
24:42
they cause a huge uh amount of
24:44
devastation. Uh wind up getting chased
24:47
onto the boat and then escape into the
24:48
open waters. Uh this whole sequence is
24:51
very interesting. Go ahead, Liz.
24:52
>> It's interesting that the they keep
24:54
talking about, you know, we need to keep
24:55
a low profile, you know, keep the
24:57
Harajum thing on the down low and then
24:59
they just set Barnes on fire. To to me,
25:02
this is this is the most Diablo thing
25:04
that happens in this entire novel is we
25:07
must be careful and cautious and choose
25:09
our path carefully and then somebody
25:11
just goes in with hammers flinging all
25:12
over the place and like something lights
25:14
on fire. It is a very Diablo video game
25:16
moment and I appreciated it personally.
25:19
>> Yeah. Unfortunately for me, I've been
25:22
playing the mo the most recent season of
25:24
Diablo II while reading this book, and
25:26
there comes a point where uh Laurath
25:28
says to you, "Now, you know, keep to the
25:31
shadows. I'm standing there as a paladin
25:33
in bright gold armor that is literally
25:36
gleaming with the light coming through
25:38
me and this enormous blazing sword." And
25:41
he's saying that, I'm like, "Yeah, yeah,
25:43
I'll keep it nice and quiet. I'll I'll
25:45
be on the down low over here. just
25:48
ignore the hissing radiance of the light
25:50
as it sears around me. So yeah, I it
25:53
does feel like that
25:54
>> I'm just getting the impression in
25:56
general the harajum are bad about
25:58
keeping it on the down low. They
26:00
>> Yeah, the harajum seem to have a real
26:02
problem with that
26:03
>> which which let's let's let's also be
26:05
clear here is a theme of the book where
26:07
they're trying to keep a low profile and
26:09
not show that they're Harajim. Like it
26:11
is it is it is very
26:13
>> literally almost everybody even the
26:14
harbor master knows that they're
26:17
>> Yeah.
26:17
>> Like immediately
26:19
>> I know who you guys are. Yeah. It's just
26:21
>> and Tyial Tyial's going through this
26:23
whole story still wearing his angelic
26:25
armor and carrying his magic angel
26:28
sword. So it's like
26:30
>> don't mind us with the simple travelers.
26:32
Is that a glowing sword?
26:36
>> So it's it's it's a little hard. I I
26:38
think they're trying their best, but
26:40
their best at stealth is not very good.
26:44
>> When Laur is your tactical guy, you
26:47
know?
26:47
>> Yeah.
26:48
>> Um, one of the things I feel about Laur
26:51
is kind of trying to be Batman here. I
26:54
mean, he's just like, uh, everyone is
26:57
dead. I will speak in a growly voice and
26:59
think only of revenge. Or except he's
27:01
he's like, I'm thinking only of justice,
27:03
but he's really um he sees a target.
27:06
He's going to kill it. That's uh that's
27:07
kind of a very video game solution to a
27:10
problem.
27:11
>> I'd say he's more the punisher, but
27:12
yeah, I get where you go.
27:13
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah, I can I can go with
27:14
that. It's just he's got this I am the
27:17
knight kind of thing going on. Maybe
27:19
that's only my head.
27:21
>> I I I see where you like I it for a
27:23
serious moment. I see where you're going
27:24
with that and I don't disagree with it.
27:26
>> I feel like it gets used much better in
27:28
the second half of the book.
27:30
>> Um ironically when he gives it up. Uh
27:33
but yeah, I I definitely get where
27:35
you're going. I think to a certain
27:36
degree they're trying the book is
27:37
attempting to contrast him and Donan.
27:40
>> Yeah.
27:40
>> And also how each of them is influencing
27:42
the other because at this point Donan's
27:46
constantly calling him in the in in the
27:48
game in D4 he's calling him the old man.
27:50
But at this point they're like only 10
27:51
years apart.
27:52
>> Yeah.
27:52
>> Like Lorath was a fairly young soldier
27:55
when he got recruited. So, he's not that
27:59
much older than Donan, but comparatively
28:02
he's like Donan's older brother at this
28:05
point in time. They're like they're
28:06
they're they're like giving each other
28:08
grief. I do like their dynamic and I
28:10
like how it like there is respect there
28:13
underneath that. You don't really get to
28:15
see it too much until later in the book,
28:16
but I do like when Donan's like, I'm
28:18
just going to go out and and Laura just
28:20
looks at him and you know, they both
28:22
know what's about to happen, but Don is
28:24
like, "I can handle it." and he goes,
28:26
"Yeah, I know you can handle it." And I
28:27
do like that stuff. I liked I actually,
28:30
again, I really like the harbor master
28:32
just because the harbor master shows off
28:33
the the human cost of all this. It's
28:36
like even people who are trying to do
28:38
something for their community are
28:40
basically pushed to the point where
28:41
they're doing awful things. Um, and I do
28:44
like Kellen because Kellen, the the the
28:47
guy whose boat it is, um, manages to
28:50
tick off Laurath enough that you get to
28:53
see Laurath as a frustrated person and
28:56
not just Batman like Liz pointed out.
28:59
>> Yeah. And I think I although I do think
29:01
that and and maybe this is one of my I
29:04
don't want to say a criticism of the
29:05
book, but like a criticism of the
29:07
characterization of Laurath is that he's
29:10
so easy to set off. like everything sets
29:13
him off and it's not just Kell but part
29:15
of it is he doesn't trust Kell and I
29:18
think that's more the important part of
29:19
it
29:20
>> because Kell's unknown while Donan is
29:23
like yeah I perfectly trust this person
29:25
he saved me from a ra a roving uh gang
29:27
that was trying to take me and I and I
29:29
bought him beer and we got we're friends
29:31
now we're besties uh and he's going to
29:33
take us to Scoos on his boat um and then
29:36
Don's like yeah what or Darth is like
29:39
yeah but what did he do And there's that
29:42
tension there where it it's you can tell
29:45
that Laurath just doesn't trust anyone.
29:49
He trusts Tyel because he knows Tyel. He
29:52
trusts Donan because Donan is
29:54
essentially a younger brother to him. Or
29:56
at least that's the impression that I
29:58
get. Uh but Kell's an outsider and he's
30:01
a variable and he's a variable that
30:02
could destabilize
30:04
what what they currently have in the
30:07
form of the balance of their
30:08
relationship. And to me, I think that's
30:11
a little bit more what they're going for
30:14
as opposed to the angry man here. Yes,
30:16
it comes across as anger, but I think
30:18
it's more of that insecurity of the
30:20
character Laurco
30:23
Sco. Um, but advancing the story, they
30:27
get the boat, they uh wind up making
30:29
their way out into open water and they
30:31
start, you know, puttering along. Um,
30:34
they have this sort of breakdown of of,
30:38
you know, who are you? what do you uh
30:39
you know what do you do? Kell sees you
30:42
know says the thing of like I see the
30:43
anger in your eyes and uh Laura starts
30:46
seeing the loss and hurt in Kellen. Uh
30:49
and they kind of like trauma bond a
30:52
little bit here and then they're
30:54
attacked by Drowned. Uh, which
30:56
>> yeah, we should mention briefly that
30:58
there's also the bit that that sets up
31:00
the whole conflict between them where
31:02
the harbor master yells out, "You don't
31:04
you think Kell's your friend?" and
31:06
reveals that he killed three people and
31:08
they're like, "Did that happen?" And he
31:10
goes, "Yep."
31:11
>> And I'm not talking about it anymore.
31:13
>> Mhm.
31:14
>> Three unarmed people is she is specific
31:17
on that point.
31:18
>> Absolutely. Yeah. And so from there as
31:21
they're going they're leaving uh
31:23
Kingsport they almost immediately run
31:25
into a big storm cuz and there's this is
31:27
one of the few times one of the be bits
31:29
of writing in this book that I really
31:30
actually liked.
31:31
>> I did really enjoy this part too. Yeah.
31:34
>> The part where it's the the chapter ends
31:36
with you know and you know the seas are
31:38
accommodating and it cuts to the next
31:40
chapter the seas were not accommodating.
31:44
>> I was like yeah I just that that you got
31:47
me book. Yeah. And you've got the big
31:49
storm where Laurath is trying to get
31:51
Kell and to to like you know pull the
31:54
boat over or something like I don't know
31:55
how you think he's going to heave to in
31:56
the storm but sure. And Kell just flat
32:00
out says this is my ship. I know it you
32:03
don't shut up and gets them through the
32:07
storm
32:08
>> which sets up more conflict between them
32:10
because he doesn't as as Joe pointed out
32:12
he doesn't trust Kell and Kell is flatly
32:15
dismissive of him when it comes to the
32:17
boat. boat. He goes, "It's my boat.
32:18
Don't put your hands on the tiller
32:19
unless I tell you. Don't do anything
32:21
unless I tell you." And
32:23
>> I mean, this is this is a key part of
32:26
Laur,
32:30
you know, in the game in the future. Um,
32:32
is that Laurath is there's a bit of a of
32:36
a know-it-all to Laur. Laura thinks he
32:38
knows the right solution to a problem
32:40
and he will grab it immediately. He's
32:44
even in his old age a tiny bit of a hot
32:47
head
32:48
>> and if he sees he if he sees the
32:49
solution he's going to go for it and he
32:51
has trouble when he gets push back on
32:54
that.
32:55
>> Yeah. And here is also the other thing I
32:56
think is interesting about this this
32:58
conflict between them is it sets up what
33:00
we're going to have later in the book.
33:02
But it also just flat out sets up that
33:04
they don't react well in crisis
33:07
together. They don't pull like they
33:09
should, which is why they end up getting
33:10
caught by another storm. And that's
33:12
where they're pushed out. And I can't
33:14
remember the name of the island. It's
33:15
not Anthulion because it's further
33:18
>> atos. Yeah.
33:20
>> And do we want to like go into the whole
33:23
thing about Atos just briefly?
33:25
Essentially, when they're asked about
33:27
it, Tyel says there's a legend that this
33:29
was the place where Lilith and Maliel
33:32
first created humanity, which is a fancy
33:35
way of saying hooked up, but regardless.
33:39
And so when Lilith turned on him and and
33:42
killed off, you know, most of the angels
33:45
so they couldn't destroy the the
33:47
Nephilim, he lost his mind and banish
33:51
her to another plane of existence and
33:52
blew up uh at let's say Atalenos. I I
33:57
can never remember this. He blew the
33:58
place up. And that's now it's a cursed
34:00
blighted land. And it doesn't say
34:03
whether or not the drowned are from
34:05
there originally,
34:07
>> but they hint at it because they hint
34:09
when the drowned are on board that like
34:11
as they see them several times the drown
34:13
are mentioned to be wearing garbs or
34:15
carrying relics that are of the
34:18
Nephilim. Uh so there is a a a a
34:22
inference I think and I think it's a
34:24
deliberate inference leading into the
34:26
next game uh that the drowned may have
34:30
originated with the original drowned or
34:32
killed Nephilim.
34:33
>> Yeah. I mean that's that seems to be the
34:35
hint like it's it's very much a stepping
34:37
on your foot going Mr. Thompson. Uh but
34:40
yeah, it's I think it's really
34:42
interesting just because that moment
34:45
where they're fighting off the ground
34:47
and and failing like it should be
34:49
pointed out they're they're failing is
34:51
when for me the book goes from it was
34:53
taking a long time to get there. Okay,
34:55
now we're starting to pick up. This is
34:56
where from this point the book feels
34:58
like it's it's switched gears. Um like
35:01
from here on the book is pretty fast.
35:04
>> Mhm.
35:04
>> At this point
35:05
>> there's a lot happening. I think it
35:07
happens over the course of like 3 days
35:09
too, like from this point on. Maybe a
35:11
week total cuz there is some boat
35:12
travel.
35:13
>> Yeah, it's it's it's not entirely clear
35:15
how much time they spend. But yeah, it's
35:17
it's we're zooming at this point.
35:21
If anything, I feel like the the book
35:23
could have spent a little more time on
35:25
all of the section in so in Sco
35:28
uh because this is this is where this is
35:32
the land. This is the unknown land for
35:34
us. these like, okay, we've seen the
35:37
Amazon and Diablo II, but you know,
35:39
we've never we've seen um we've met the
35:42
Sisters of the Sightless Eye. We've so
35:45
we have some experience with Amazon, but
35:48
very little and we've never been to
35:50
Scobos. We've heard about Scobos. We
35:51
never been there. And this is a great
35:54
opportunity to explore and talk about
35:57
how the place uh works, how the oracles
36:00
work, how all of this how all of this
36:03
land exists and how it exists in this
36:07
new era after Malfiel. But I it just
36:10
feels, you know, um, for people who have
36:14
listened to our previous Diablo podcast,
36:16
I didn't really enjoy Vessel of Hatred
36:19
because I felt like, uh, like it had a
36:22
couple of stories that it just sort of
36:24
wrapped up really quickly instead of
36:26
telling one story very well. And it
36:28
feels like it feels like we've just
36:30
scratched the surface here. And it feels
36:32
like we could have spent more time
36:33
exploring what's going on in Scoos. But
36:36
the book does move very quickly, which
36:38
on one hand, that's a good thing. We're
36:40
getting through we're getting we're
36:42
getting on with the story. We're getting
36:43
through a lot of action. But on the
36:44
other hand, I would have liked to have
36:46
seen more of Scoas and talked more about
36:48
the place and the people.
36:49
>> Yeah. And I but I think that this is
36:51
where the book has to draw like a really
36:53
fine line because you the whole book is
36:58
only like it's just under 300 pages. And
37:02
that may sound like a lot, but part of
37:05
the reason why I think it picks up here,
37:06
and it's not a bad thing, uh, is it's
37:08
got a lot to get through to get us to
37:10
the end in that in that short period of
37:12
time. And I think if they had spent more
37:15
time explaining the aisles or exploring
37:18
them like we would have wanted,
37:20
>> it would I think that maybe wasn't the
37:22
intention of the book as so much as
37:26
laying some seeds to be grown when we
37:28
get to the game itself. um which I think
37:31
it does a very good job of that. I will
37:33
I will give it a lot of credit for that.
37:35
Um because one of the things it did make
37:37
me want to do is it was describing these
37:39
places uh in these short bursts and
37:42
giving brief descriptions and being done
37:44
through the lens of you know the Amazon
37:46
talking about these islands to the uh
37:49
the three main characters uh and talking
37:51
about the the society of Scoos and how
37:54
everything was is that these are places
37:57
I want to explore more of myself. I want
38:00
to go to these places and poke around.
38:02
And I think it does a very good job of
38:04
that while then focusing in on the main
38:05
story, which is the main island. Um, and
38:09
then not the main island for the the
38:12
capital city of Sco. Uh, the island
38:15
where the Sears live and then the
38:18
>> is the city.
38:19
>> Yeah, thank you. And then where the
38:21
Harajum cache is supposed to be, which
38:24
is why they're coming to Sco in the
38:27
first place, is to check on the Harajum
38:29
that went here years before that tier
38:31
that Tyial sent forward and hadn't heard
38:33
from again, but then to find this cache
38:35
of Harajum uh artifacts, which we know
38:39
they have strewn all about the world uh
38:42
that may have things to help them
38:43
protect uh sanctuary as a whole. And
38:47
>> yeah, especially I think we need to
38:48
mention that one of the things about
38:50
this, one of the revelations it gives
38:52
you about Tyial is that becoming mortal.
38:55
Uh we we originally see him in Diablo
38:57
II, he doesn't have any memory at all of
38:59
himself until he gets uh Elderine in his
39:01
hands again. Even now, he does not
39:05
remember his entire angelic life.
39:08
>> Like there's stuff that he has done and
39:10
and was was a big part of as an
39:13
archangel that it's not that he has
39:15
forgotten it. It's that it is just so
39:17
unimaginably distant from his mortal
39:21
life that he doesn't it's not something
39:23
he he immediately recalls. He has to go
39:25
to this vault just to make sure that it
39:28
is as he remembers it and he remembers
39:31
it like thinking like you know it's me
39:34
Jared Ka you know Jared Kane Talasha and
39:37
uh you know Sultan Cool all started
39:40
this. It's like any It's like if you've
39:43
played Diablo II, you know what that
39:45
group must have been like. You know
39:48
those guys on a boat together.
39:51
>> Trouble. Trouble. A lot of trouble.
39:53
>> You're just trying to imagine Sultan
39:55
Cool and and and Jared Kane and Tyel all
39:59
in a boat together. Tasha is like, you
40:00
know, I would rather have Dal's demonic
40:03
essence shoved into my head than be on
40:04
this. Um, and it just it is one of those
40:07
bits that it helps set up everything
40:10
Tyial does in the story. And it's it's
40:12
weird. They break it up and they
40:14
basically they get captured sort of
40:17
while while being killed by the drama. I
40:19
feel we need to run through this real
40:20
quick.
40:20
>> Yeah. They're save they're saved by
40:22
they're saved by Amazon and then
40:25
>> taken
40:25
>> which has a really Yeah, it has a great
40:27
scene of them using what is essentially
40:29
Greek fire on the drowned because
40:31
there's like you know nope, we got to
40:32
get nope to the drowned. We're just
40:34
gonna burn all of them. Uh then the
40:37
captain of the ship, uh Captain Adran,
40:39
is it is it Adrinon? Yeah, Adrinona.
40:42
Okay. I can't forget.
40:44
>> Yeah, Adriana. Adriana is the captain of
40:47
the ship. And she basically tells them,
40:48
"All right, uh we're going to we're
40:50
going to confine you now and we're going
40:52
to take you. You say you want to talk to
40:53
the queen,
40:54
>> we're going to take you to the queen."
40:56
And they do that. And once they have
40:58
their audience with the queen, she's
41:00
very she's much more receptive than you
41:02
might expect her to be.
41:04
In fact, everybody seems a little
41:05
surprised by how receptive she is. But
41:07
as Liz pointed out, they point out to
41:10
Tyel, "Well, you're wearing the armor of
41:13
an angel. We know what those look like
41:14
cuz we've got them on statues
41:16
everywhere."
41:17
>> Yeah. After after Tyel makes a point of
41:19
telling them to hide their Harajra uh
41:21
like charms and and icons, like he
41:24
doesn't think to take off his angelic
41:26
armor. Nope.
41:27
>> And he's got he's got Elderine right on
41:29
his hip.
41:30
>> Yeah. It's like it's literally the sword
41:33
of justice.
41:34
>> And I love I love Tyel. I love Tyel not
41:37
lying but not telling the whole truth
41:39
which I think was a very human moment.
41:42
So like she asks, "Well, you know, your
41:44
armor is you're wearing angelic armor.
41:47
Where is it from?" And he's like, "It's
41:48
in family heirloom." Uh like which I
41:51
thought was like it's like Tyel not
41:53
lying because it technically is true.
41:56
Uh, but it's also like he's learned
41:58
omission at this point, which was
42:01
absolutely fascinating to me. I loved
42:03
that particular moment. And also the
42:06
fact where he tells the other two, let
42:07
me do the talking. And the the implied
42:10
thing is, you're too angry, Laurth and
42:12
Donan, you're just going to tell them
42:14
everything, so maybe you should just not
42:15
talk.
42:16
>> Yeah, it's like the angry dog and the
42:17
the friendly dog. I we need an actual
42:20
person here, so I'll do this. Um, I also
42:23
like that you get the split up here
42:26
where the we get basically what I would
42:27
call the AB and C stories. And
42:30
ironically, Tyel gets the C story.
42:33
>> Yeah.
42:34
>> You know, and that's I think that's
42:35
actually a good move because by focusing
42:37
on Laurath and and Donan as they are
42:41
going through the things that the queen
42:43
has basically said, you one of you has
42:44
to go fight the the drowned because you
42:46
know, you got to prove yourself to us.
42:48
One of you I want to keep here and talk
42:50
to. That's gonna be you, pretty guy from
42:53
the sky who I don't know fell from the
42:55
sky, but I like that armor. And also,
42:56
again, you're really pretty. And uh you
42:59
third guy, I don't care. Go wander
43:02
about, do stuff. You can do you can do
43:04
whatever what it is he said you're here
43:06
to do, which is not actually what you're
43:07
here to do, but you're going to do it
43:09
because you think it's a good idea.
43:11
>> And so, you get the three stories. You
43:13
get the the story from Laura's point of
43:14
view. And at least I will give them
43:16
credit for like Adrona,
43:19
is that her name again? Adra. can never
43:21
remember.
43:21
>> Adreiona
43:22
>> Adreiona Adreiona and Lauras start off
43:26
barely liking each other and the book
43:29
does a nice compressed enemies to well
43:31
we don't actually do anything but we're
43:34
looking at each other a lot.
43:36
>> Um I like
43:37
>> I could have done I could have done
43:39
without a romance subplot in my Diablo
43:41
novel. That's just that's just me. I
43:43
could have done without it.
43:44
>> No, I I I like that it doesn't get to
43:46
romance like they both realize you can't
43:48
do this. Did you Did you miss the part
43:51
where
43:52
>> Yeah, the sex part. Yeah, I didn't
43:54
really
43:56
>> I'll be upfront in a Diablo book. I I
43:59
was It took me a little while to realize
44:01
it happened. I was like, "Oh, right.
44:03
Okay, yeah, sure." But, you know, the
44:06
Donan stuff, honestly, I like Donan's
44:09
relationship with the the elder sister
44:11
to the the Oracle Queen. I like that a
44:13
lot more because she basically like
44:16
immediately big sisters him.
44:18
>> Yeah. Yeah,
44:19
>> like
44:19
>> within seconds they're like, "Oh, yeah.
44:20
You need you need somebody to go with
44:22
you. You've got a lot of potential, but
44:24
you need help." Uh, and so I like their
44:27
story. I like that they, you know,
44:28
actually figure out what's going on with
44:30
the Herodrick, you know, expedition. Uh,
44:33
I like that the prophecy is introduced
44:35
here because you knew the prophecy was
44:36
going to be introduced because it's an
44:38
oracle queen for God's sake.
44:39
>> Yeah. Let's let's take a couple minutes
44:40
here. I because we have we have about 15
44:42
minutes left before we need to start
44:44
wrapping things up. Um, I I think the
44:46
diversion of the story, I think, is
44:48
where, like you said, it gets really
44:49
interesting. But what I really enjoy is
44:52
the things that we learned about the
44:54
oracles in general,
44:56
>> because Donan's trip isn't just about
44:58
getting to the Oracle Queen. We learn a
45:01
bunch of stuff. How the oracles, all of
45:04
them, have sort of like an assigned
45:08
task.
45:09
um and how their powers are like rooted
45:13
in a deep mysticism, but there is an
45:16
exchange. And the first oracle that he
45:20
that Donan comes across is at the the I
45:23
think it's like the temple of the the
45:25
fang, I believe it is. Um which is this
45:27
like this crossroads part that's like at
45:30
the beginning of the pilgrimage to make
45:32
the trek to the oracle queen to receive
45:34
your prophecy. And as he's talking with
45:37
the woman, uh his impression is, "Oh,
45:39
there's this uh wizzed old woman." And
45:42
he asks her, "Hey, did you see my
45:44
compatriots?" You know, they would have
45:46
been these three uh uh the one is this
45:49
Yonshi woman. Um powerful sorceress. Um
45:54
and the the woman goes, "Uh that was
45:57
before my time." And Donan doesn't
46:00
understand because here's this old woman
46:02
in front of him. And it's like, but this
46:04
was only a few years ago. Like, what?
46:06
What do you mean before your time? Was
46:09
this before your station? And she goes,
46:10
"No, I've always been stationed here."
46:12
And then he finds out that in order to
46:14
gain the power of prophecy, as they do,
46:17
they use their life force. They use and
46:20
and this is a call back. And if you've
46:23
read um the original like Sin Wars
46:27
books, the Sin Wars trilogy, this is a
46:29
nod to that. And I thought that was a
46:31
really interesting and wellplaced thing
46:33
because the Nephilim and and the humans
46:36
that were descended from it that had
46:37
power, it's described back then that
46:40
they draw it from within themselves. And
46:43
here the oracles are literally using
46:46
their life force as fuel for their
46:48
duties, which I thought was just such a
46:51
a really fascinating touch. I don't know
46:54
how you guys felt about that.
46:55
>> It ties in it ties into something else
46:57
that even I think Donan in the book
46:58
says. uh don the book says how can they
47:01
do their prophecies if they've lost this
47:03
sightless eye and Tyel just says there
47:06
are other ways
47:08
>> and you you get the sense Tyel knows
47:11
this and isn't he isn't bringing it to
47:15
anyone's attention he's not mentioning
47:16
it to them but you also get that sense
47:18
that the thing with the blood cult and
47:21
the thing with blood into a lot of
47:23
Diablo I there's a lot of blood in like
47:28
>> Oh go ahead Liz I'm going to let you
47:29
talk about cuz you're the one that first
47:30
opened my eyes to it. So, it's like a
47:33
religion.
47:33
>> Go back to the go to the very first
47:36
Diablo I trailer. Blood is the key.
47:40
>> Yeah.
47:40
>> And that's and it's not demon blood.
47:44
It's human blood. It's the blood of the
47:47
children of angels and demons. The blood
47:49
of the children of the Nephilim that has
47:52
this power. The most powerful magic in
47:56
Diablo is blood magic. Blood is the key
47:59
to so many things. And when we're
48:01
talking about blood, it's it's not just
48:04
any blood. It's human blood. So, it is
48:07
going back to the original combination
48:09
of demonic and angelic powers blended
48:12
together, catalyzed in the blood of
48:14
these children
48:16
hundreds or thousands of generations
48:18
later. That blood still has power, still
48:21
has potential even as even as they tried
48:25
to lock it away. So we come a lot to uh
48:29
to blood magic and I think here as well
48:32
you see there is there is all of this
48:34
potential in the children of the
48:37
Nephilim even though their ne their
48:40
great powers have been stripped away
48:42
over the generations there is all of
48:44
this potential the power in their blood
48:46
is still there but it does seem to take
48:51
magic and ritual but it's still about
48:54
sacrifice there is still when they are
48:57
sacrificing of their life force. There
48:59
is some implication that there is
49:01
physical harm involved you know not just
49:04
not just you know a transfer of energy
49:07
giving up your kind of symbolic life
49:10
force and aging but like a physical
49:12
mutilation kind of thing for these
49:15
things to happen. So, I do find this a
49:18
very interesting through line. And
49:21
again, this is also one of those other
49:24
and again, I don't want to take too much
49:26
time because we want I want to get
49:27
through this, but I also thought the the
49:29
other interesting reveals were as they
49:33
were traveling through this city and
49:34
then when they got to the fort, so like
49:35
when Laurath and and Adriana get to the
49:38
fort to reinforce against the uh the
49:41
drowned, you learn that everything is
49:45
not as it seems. that the like on the
49:49
outward appearance the Amazon are secure
49:52
that the Skolo Isles survived better
49:54
than most. You were saying something,
49:56
Liz.
49:56
>> I I was about to say what you just said
49:58
that yes, there's this impression that
50:00
Sco is surprisingly well off compared to
50:03
how everyone else is after Malfail.
50:06
>> Yeah. And and then you start to see the
50:08
cracks and this is where it starts to
50:12
like Matt said, you start to get all the
50:14
pieces in place. like the queen seems
50:17
very knowledgeable, but then you start
50:19
to get the the realization that maybe
50:20
she hasn't really left the palace very
50:22
often and doesn't really know what's
50:25
going on with her people as much as you
50:27
think that they would. You learn that
50:29
the Ascari Guard were created in the
50:32
aftermath of uh what they call the Silks
50:35
were created in the aftermath of the the
50:38
uh what happened with Mal, the calling.
50:41
Uh, and that they're doing is they're
50:42
going through and uh through Donan's
50:45
story and the story with Lorath and a
50:48
little bit of of the tyial uh reading
50:51
cuz he's basically in a library the
50:52
entire time. I mean, the dream um you
50:56
learn that they're going and taking
50:59
everything. They're they're they're
51:01
basically taking a tithe from all people
51:03
and what they're doing with it is air
51:06
quote distributing it for the good of
51:08
the survivors. and you start to as a
51:11
reader get the realization that well
51:13
they're not right. Um there there you
51:17
can see the corruption. You can see that
51:19
something is is a miss that something is
51:21
going on uh you know that isn't what
51:25
they say. And
51:26
>> yeah and there's actually a good call
51:27
back to Kingsport in this. So I give him
51:29
credit on this one. Um there's a bottle
51:32
that that Donan takes when they when
51:36
they first encounter the uh harbor
51:39
master that has a seal like a trident on
51:41
it and it's the the infamous Sco wine
51:44
that that they originally said to the
51:46
bartender, well, you've got Scoos wine.
51:47
It must have come from somewhere. All of
51:49
that comes back to it turns out that the
51:51
the silks, the es the escara guard are
51:55
part of a smuggling ring. They're
51:56
literally taking the tythe that they
51:58
take from people and and cherrypicking
52:00
out things and smuggling them over to
52:03
Kingsport where they're then paid an
52:05
exorbitant amount for them and they they
52:08
bring that money back and put it into
52:09
their war chest because the the one of
52:12
the two main captains you meet in this
52:14
story besides Adriiona I I can't
52:17
Milanine
52:18
Milanine I I don't know how to pronounce
52:20
it. Uh, but she's actually the current
52:24
sitting queen's daughter, and you don't
52:26
find that out for a long time. It
52:27
doesn't get mentioned until near the
52:28
end, but she's the one
52:30
>> Myina.
52:31
>> Myina. Okay. She's the one who is
52:34
actually running the silks and all the
52:37
smuggling stuff because should we like
52:41
mention it now or just like, you know,
52:42
just wait till later to explain why
52:45
she's doing it? I mean, I didn't feel
52:47
like we got a great explanation of why
52:50
in particular she's smuggling things.
52:52
>> Yeah. And I think maybe and
52:53
>> just
52:54
>> we're running out of time, so I kind of
52:55
want to I want to wrap it up, but I
52:56
think this is one of my one of my gripes
52:58
about it too,
52:59
>> right? Like we don't One is like when
53:02
Laura and Donna and and and Kell get
53:04
picked up and and and and Tyel, they're
53:07
picked up because they're they're being
53:08
arrested as if they're smugglers, right?
53:11
and pirates
53:12
>> or pirates and that we know that at
53:15
least part of the guard is trying to
53:16
fight against that.
53:18
>> And the other part, it's not explicitly
53:20
said that they're the ones supplying the
53:23
harbor master. It's more implied by the
53:24
Harajum that they are, but there's no
53:26
denials of it. Um, but we're never given
53:28
a reason why they would have done
53:30
something like there's no
53:32
>> I mean, there's exactly two things in
53:35
the book that I think are supposed to be
53:36
your explanation. There's the bit where
53:38
Donan finds the big empty section that's
53:42
just behind walls and there's just
53:43
nothing there and he's there's one woman
53:46
sitting there and he goes up to her and
53:47
goes, "Uh, I'm sorry. I don't mean to
53:48
bother you, but what's up with this?"
53:51
And she goes, "When the the when the
53:53
angels came to kill us, uh, my husband
53:56
died, my daughter died, everyone died.
53:58
So many died. And there were so many
54:00
bodies, we didn't have any the field of
54:03
sorrow." Yeah. the giant master.
54:04
>> He says that, you know, the the the
54:06
queen didn't come help us. Uh the Amazon
54:09
didn't come help us.
54:11
And then later when when Milein is
54:14
explaining her the she's yelling at her
54:17
mother and she basically says, "Why
54:18
couldn't you have just resigned? I could
54:20
I wouldn't have had to do any of this.
54:22
You when I came to you and told you what
54:24
was happening, you didn't come out. You
54:26
didn't lead the troops out. We didn't
54:28
defend anyone. You you forced them to
54:31
stay here and protect you. And that's
54:32
when I knew you weren't worthy. You
54:34
could have just resigned and I could
54:36
have taken over. I could have fixed
54:37
everything, but you didn't. So now I had
54:40
to do all of this. And it's like heavily
54:42
implied that she's doing all this
54:43
because she blames her mother for not
54:46
going out just like that villager did.
54:48
But that's the only time. You only get
54:50
those twice. And it's like it's barely
54:53
it's like one brief mention and then
54:55
most of the book happens and then she
54:58
throws that out and but then the Titan
54:59
shows up because she's calling it
55:02
>> and it's just it it
55:05
>> this is the
55:05
>> this to me is the biggest problem with
55:07
the pace of the book once we get to Sco
55:10
>> like I felt
55:10
>> which is why I think we needed more Sco
55:13
to begin with you could have unfolded
55:14
it. Go ahead. It's it starts out slow
55:17
and then it gets very very fast in the
55:20
last, you know, twothirds of the book,
55:22
half of the book. But yes, the smuggling
55:24
thing, it seems like, okay, this is
55:26
generalized corruption. It's like, okay,
55:28
we've uh in the aftermath of this great
55:30
disaster, we've given ourselves power
55:32
and it's like, oh, now we can take all
55:34
of this stuff. What do we do with all of
55:36
this stuff? Wow, all of this stuff is
55:38
worth money. You know, it's it's kind of
55:41
like it's having this great power has
55:43
begat corruption. But there's not a
55:45
clear reason why Mina wanted or needed
55:49
this power, this wealth. So, it's just
55:52
is she turning a blind eye to smuggling?
55:55
Is she leading the smuggling ring? We
55:58
don't really know. I think there's
55:59
there's a lot going on on Scovos that we
56:02
don't learn about that could have been
56:03
explored a little more.
56:05
>> So, and and I think that's part of the
56:06
problem and this is where I think I take
56:09
uh a little bit of umbrage with the
56:11
book. But the problem that I have is I
56:12
don't know if this is intentional or not
56:15
because some of it I think could be uh
56:18
put making it a little more vague than
56:20
you would expect because this is stuff
56:24
that we might discover in the expansion
56:27
or as stuff or story and quests unfold
56:30
or is it simply we needed another 100
56:33
pages of of of breath to get the story
56:36
out? I don't know. And that's and it's
56:39
one of those weird in between places
56:41
because and this is a struggle with
56:43
video game novels in general is when
56:45
you're you're acting as a bridge and in
56:48
this case it's a bridge between Diablo
56:50
II and where we're going in Diablo I
56:53
with the Scoville Isles in particular.
56:56
um we don't know what they're going to
56:58
present to us in that expansion that may
57:02
be things that tie back to what we read
57:04
in the novel, which to me is very very
57:08
it's it's frustrating, but it's also
57:11
interesting because the author has to
57:13
work within a weird set of confines that
57:15
we don't know. And it can it can cause
57:18
and we we we've had we've talked with
57:20
authors before like when we had Meline
57:22
Ru on we we talked about like some of
57:24
the stuff that you know she has had to
57:26
deal with with getting the story out.
57:28
That's one of the things that they
57:30
commented on and that could be very true
57:31
here. But I think that takes me to my
57:34
largest uh complaint about Diablo lore
57:37
in general, which is it at best has been
57:42
exceedingly inconsistent recently.
57:46
>> And I I find myself
57:48
>> I like your use of the word recently.
57:50
>> It it it I said exceedingly. I'm not
57:53
saying that it hasn't been inconsistent.
57:55
It's been more so lately.
57:58
>> It used to be consistently
58:01
lightweight. Yeah.
58:02
>> Yeah.
58:03
>> So, I mean, I don't know. How do you how
58:04
do you guys feel about that in general?
58:06
Do you do you agree with me?
58:09
>> Yeah. I mean, I think a a tie-in novel
58:12
has a very hard job in that it has to
58:14
fit in with the constraints of the game
58:16
world. It has to, you know, there may be
58:19
lines in place that Blizzard has given
58:22
them that they can't cross or things
58:24
they can't talk about, which may make
58:25
certain topics seem awkward. there may
58:27
be things that they have to talk about
58:29
that don't maybe don't entirely feel
58:31
like they fit into the story as well as
58:33
they might. So, it's it's you've got to
58:37
writing a novel like this, you've got to
58:39
to fall into some very specific lines
58:41
and it can make the novel feel a little
58:43
weird.
58:44
>> Yeah, Matt,
58:45
>> I'm going to say this. Uh, one of the
58:48
things about every time I've seen any
58:51
sort of tie-in media or even like moving
58:54
from game to game, the lore of Diablo is
58:57
so vaporous that it's it's not
59:00
necessarily hard to fit in enormous
59:03
swaths of new material. And you could
59:06
argue it's a retcon because it goes back
59:08
to like, you know, thousands of years in
59:10
the past, but it's not like we had
59:13
anything about this already. It's just
59:16
it's like saying you know they started
59:18
the in the beginning the world was
59:20
created then 50,000 years later this
59:23
happened and you've got 50,000 years
59:26
that you know that that you you this
59:28
used to be a sentence now it's an entire
59:31
novel now it's multiple novels. Um I
59:34
feel like we don't know much of anything
59:37
about the the distant past of Sanctuary
59:41
other than it happened. We know that
59:43
there were the firstborn or the Nephilim
59:46
or whatever you want to call them. And
59:48
some of them like Wrathma and Bulcathos
59:51
and Eos were enormously powerful and had
59:55
a long had practically immortal. Like
59:57
Rathma didn't die until he got killed by
1:00:00
his dad, the angel. Um, and I'm sorry
1:00:03
that's in the in Diablo. It's a big deal
1:00:05
right in the freaking beginning at this
1:00:06
point. You guys, you got to know about
1:00:08
it. Um, that whole deal it's it's like
1:00:11
nebulous. What was he doing for all that
1:00:13
time before the sin war? Like when
1:00:17
Fiakla Gear/Vassi
1:00:19
and Bulcathos were like rough rough and
1:00:22
tumble brothers who went on adventures
1:00:24
together. At what point did they
1:00:25
establish nations? Because they did.
1:00:28
Scots Glenn and you know the whole deal
1:00:31
with Mount Aott. How far apart were
1:00:33
those events? We we don't know. Diablo
1:00:36
has never been good at giving you any
1:00:38
answers to any of this. And I don't mind
1:00:41
that. I I actually kind of enjoyed that
1:00:43
they just pulled like an Atlantis, you
1:00:45
know, analog and also kind of made it
1:00:47
the Garden of Eden. It's it's cool and
1:00:50
interesting, but at the same time, it
1:00:53
feels like the lore of Diablo I at this
1:00:54
point is is never explaining itself. And
1:00:58
I don't say I'm not saying I want an
1:01:00
exposition NPC to show up and go, "Oh,
1:01:02
hey, Matt, there's some stuff you want
1:01:03
to know." I'm just saying it feels like
1:01:06
the book is being given these things
1:01:08
that to to tell you and then it doesn't
1:01:11
like we don't go to see the island with
1:01:15
all the drowned like you know what's
1:01:17
like you tell us there's stuff there and
1:01:20
that's it.
1:01:21
>> But again like I'm wondering if that I'm
1:01:23
wondering if that is something that
1:01:24
we're going to do in the game in the
1:01:26
expansion.
1:01:26
>> Yeah. And that's the thing as you said,
1:01:28
part of the frustration is not knowing
1:01:30
like it reminds me an awful lot of one
1:01:32
of my the books that I'm the most like
1:01:36
it's it's a World of Warcraft uh tie-in
1:01:38
novel. One that I'm the most empathet
1:01:40
antipathetic about uh I like and and
1:01:43
dislike it. It's the the Dawn of the
1:01:45
Ancients Dragon book.
1:01:47
>> Mhm.
1:01:48
>> And it's like on the one hand, I'm glad
1:01:51
to see all this old dragon stuff. On the
1:01:53
other hand, it feels like every time you
1:01:55
answered a question, you you gave me
1:01:56
four more and you didn't answer those.
1:02:00
And it's like and at some point like
1:02:02
when when Dragonflight came out, I
1:02:04
thought we're going to get all the
1:02:05
answers. We got about a third of them.
1:02:08
And then that each of them also created
1:02:09
more questions. It very much that just
1:02:12
raised us further questions. I felt like
1:02:14
this book, it it had so many things it
1:02:16
was trying to do and possibly unfairly
1:02:20
to the book that it ended up like like
1:02:22
Liz pointed out, it ended up feeling
1:02:24
like the first third is just wind up and
1:02:27
and not really going anywhere and then
1:02:29
suddenly boom, the tire finally hit the
1:02:31
ground
1:02:32
>> and the book shot across the rest of the
1:02:34
distance
1:02:34
>> and it was over before we really got
1:02:36
what we wanted on this.
1:02:38
and
1:02:38
>> like, "Oh, I want
1:02:40
>> you get to the end and you're like, wow,
1:02:41
I could read another 50 pages, 100 pages
1:02:43
of talking about, but yeah,
1:02:46
>> there's a lot of really good moments.
1:02:48
Like, I like I like um the whole
1:02:51
relationship with Donan and and uh my
1:02:54
god, Laura, thank you, brain." Um, I
1:02:57
like their relationship. I like how it
1:02:58
changes, but at the same time, there's
1:03:00
kind of a there's always an undercurrent
1:03:02
of, you know, I I am your, you know, we
1:03:05
are we are not we are not born brothers,
1:03:07
but we chose to be brothers to each
1:03:09
other, and we are brothers in all the
1:03:11
good and all the bad ways. The other
1:03:13
side of this too, and this is something
1:03:15
that I think is um worth mentioning uh
1:03:18
because we don't there's another thing
1:03:20
coming out that might have also played a
1:03:22
factor in this uh that we didn't really
1:03:24
talk about which is and we will be
1:03:26
talking about in the future is there is
1:03:27
a Diablo comic coming out very very
1:03:29
soon. And we don't know what if anything
1:03:33
is also going to be explored in there
1:03:35
that will tie back to things that were
1:03:38
started in this novel or things that
1:03:40
will be being experienced in the
1:03:42
expansion. So like it but I I I agree
1:03:45
with both of you. The problem that I
1:03:47
have with the book is not it's not a bad
1:03:49
book and it's not a great book. It's and
1:03:53
I say this not like as a condemnation of
1:03:55
it. It just doesn't give me enough of
1:03:58
what I wanted. It gave me like this the
1:04:01
the like one bite of like really good
1:04:03
steak and like I want more of it, but
1:04:06
then it moves over to something else and
1:04:08
then I get a really good bite of
1:04:10
something else and then it moves on to
1:04:11
something else because it has to have
1:04:13
this sort of like frantic pace to get
1:04:15
through everything. And I really would
1:04:18
have wished for either a a longer
1:04:20
experience or a multi-book experience
1:04:24
because the other problem is even though
1:04:26
we're going into an expansion, Diablo
1:04:29
expansions have been
1:04:32
questionable in how it presents its
1:04:34
story and how much it gives you in the
1:04:36
event of the main quest line that you go
1:04:38
through. Um,
1:04:39
>> I don't think it's fair Diablo
1:04:40
expansions. I feel it's safe to say
1:04:42
Vessel of Hatred felt like it was just
1:04:45
getting started and
1:04:46
>> and then ended. Yeah, I would I would
1:04:47
agree with that.
1:04:48
>> Yeah.
1:04:48
>> I don't think it's fair to like for
1:04:50
instance, Reaper of Souls, say what you
1:04:51
want about it.
1:04:52
>> Oh, no. Yeah, I will agree.
1:04:54
>> Perfect. And I would and you know, of
1:04:56
course, uh Lord of Destruction is a
1:04:58
masterpiece. Diablo II's expansion, its
1:05:01
only expansion, is an absolute
1:05:03
masterpiece. It's it's one of the best
1:05:05
expansions to a video game.
1:05:07
Unfortunately, Vessel of Hatred
1:05:09
definitely feels like it was good, but
1:05:12
it could have been better if it had
1:05:14
picked a lane.
1:05:15
>> Yeah.
1:05:16
>> And that's I'm hoping Lord of Hatred is
1:05:19
the lane being picked. Uh but I I do
1:05:22
think that this book felt like either it
1:05:25
should have just gone they should have
1:05:26
literally started with them trying to
1:05:27
get a boat to Sco or it should have had
1:05:30
more of of just just general life on the
1:05:35
Liz has been saying this whole time.
1:05:36
Give it a 100 more pages. Give it 100
1:05:38
more pages. I think
1:05:39
>> I think that would have been good. Yeah,
1:05:41
>> six seasons in a movie.
1:05:43
>> Maybe not six seasons, but 100 more
1:05:45
pages.
1:05:45
>> Diablo show, you cowards.
1:05:48
>> Well, yeah. You know, I would I would
1:05:50
watch Di I would watch the heck of a out
1:05:52
of a Diablo animated series.
1:05:54
>> Yeah. I I think I agree though. I think
1:05:55
the book it felt like it needed a little
1:05:57
more runway before it could really
1:05:59
complete its its its takeoff and
1:06:01
landing. Um, and I don't know that that
1:06:03
and I I don't blame the author for that.
1:06:05
I I I think that and I we know this for
1:06:08
a fact after uh talking with some of the
1:06:11
people that worked on plenty of the
1:06:14
Warcraft novelizations. We know they do
1:06:16
this with their other stuff as well. Um
1:06:18
they're given a a a rubric, right?
1:06:21
They're given a a outline of here's
1:06:24
everything you're you're going to hit
1:06:26
and here's everything you're not allowed
1:06:27
to hit. And then they're, you know, they
1:06:29
move on and they do their thing. And I
1:06:31
think it does a disservice because I do
1:06:32
like a lot of like what you know they
1:06:36
they started really putting down with
1:06:37
like the interpersonal relationship
1:06:39
between Laurath and Donan. And I would
1:06:41
have loved 50 more pages of those two
1:06:45
like just kind of like going at like at
1:06:47
each other or like like having that
1:06:49
brotherly love.
1:06:50
>> Tyial's father Cadfail was one of my
1:06:52
favorite things in this book. It's just
1:06:54
Tyel just very quietly Columbboing his
1:06:56
way through the library asking just the
1:06:59
right amount of question to get an
1:07:01
answer and then acting like oh yeah
1:07:03
that's interesting. Say um have you
1:07:06
heard about Titans by any chance? Like
1:07:08
it just I loved that bit that whole bit.
1:07:11
>> I have a question for both of you.
1:07:14
Titans and Diablo have we heard of these
1:07:16
things before?
1:07:18
>> Kind of. Uh
1:07:19
>> yeah, they're mentioned they're
1:07:21
mentioned in terms of like the the mage
1:07:23
wars. You you see their remains of them.
1:07:26
>> Um they they've often been indicated to
1:07:28
be like from the older period.
1:07:31
>> Funnily funnily enough, in in Diablo I
1:07:34
and in Diablo II resurrected, um there
1:07:37
is a uh I believe it's a it's either
1:07:40
unique or
1:07:42
um it might have been the the artifact
1:07:44
weapon at the time. There has always
1:07:47
been a javelin in the game called Titans
1:07:50
Revenge, uh, which was used for JavaSon
1:07:55
builds ever since way back when. Um, and
1:07:58
it was one of those items that
1:08:00
mechanically was just really strong and
1:08:03
it gave like plus two to every Amazon
1:08:05
skill, plus 20 decks and strength and
1:08:08
like uh you made you faster and more
1:08:11
agile. Um, it was a it was just an
1:08:14
absolute
1:08:15
like monster of an item. Uh and then the
1:08:19
vessel of hatred expansion is the next
1:08:22
time we get a reference to it when
1:08:24
you're in caress under city. Um where I
1:08:28
believe it's described that they're uh a
1:08:31
race of giants in the pandemonium realm.
1:08:34
Um, so like we have had references to
1:08:36
them before, but we've never really seen
1:08:40
one or at least to my knowledge have
1:08:44
never had one really talked about on
1:08:47
Sanctuary in general. But I did think
1:08:49
that it was very interesting that they
1:08:52
finally gave us a reason why Titan's
1:08:54
Revenge existed in Diablo II, which
1:08:56
>> and why it's a Amazon weapon
1:08:59
>> and why it is specifically the Amazon
1:09:00
weapon. Cuz the other interesting thing
1:09:02
is that they drop a lot of hints about
1:09:05
the origins of Scoos in this book and
1:09:07
they do it in such a way that they're
1:09:08
never immediately picked up on. Like the
1:09:10
idea that the original queens were the
1:09:13
children of that mortal sea or Felios.
1:09:16
Uh I think Felios is actually the angel.
1:09:19
>> Yes.
1:09:20
>> That was that was you know so that angel
1:09:23
and that human that were having an
1:09:24
affair. or the sightless eye was
1:09:26
originally created so that that the the
1:09:28
the human could keep talking to the
1:09:30
angel when they parted because the
1:09:32
angels are all leaving. Um, and that's
1:09:35
the origin of the the sightless eye.
1:09:37
It's essentially it's like, you know,
1:09:39
someone's burn it's a burner phone for
1:09:41
the angel to talk to the side piece that
1:09:43
they're not allowed to have. That's
1:09:45
literally the deal. That's why it
1:09:47
existed. Um, it just also happens to
1:09:49
have all sorts of other massive powers
1:09:51
because, you know, the angels don't ever
1:09:53
do anything, right?
1:09:55
here you go. Here's an enormously
1:09:57
powerful artifact will allow you to call
1:09:58
me and see the future, but that part,
1:10:00
who cares?
1:10:03
>> Well, that said, I think we should wrap
1:10:05
it there. Um, we didn't go into whole
1:10:07
too much detail about the book. We don't
1:10:09
want to ruin everything for you. I do
1:10:11
think that it is worth reading. I do
1:10:13
think that if you, uh, are going to, you
1:10:16
know, get into the new Diablo I
1:10:17
expansion or even if you're just
1:10:19
interested in Diablo lore, it's worth
1:10:21
the read. Um, just be aware that the
1:10:24
first, you know, third of it, maybe a
1:10:26
little bit less, is all buildup and all
1:10:29
like world building.
1:10:31
>> Remember, it gets better. If you're
1:10:33
strug if you pick up the book and you're
1:10:34
struggling with the beginning, it really
1:10:36
gets going once they get to Scoas.
1:10:38
There's just there's a little ways to go
1:10:41
until that happens.
1:10:41
>> In modern video games, you often hear,
1:10:43
"Oh, no, keep playing till you get to
1:10:45
level whatever." This book is like an
1:10:48
age manages to give you that experience
1:10:51
and know because I do think it once it
1:10:53
gets to Sco it it really does pick up
1:10:56
and I do think that this the there's a
1:10:59
lot of stuff in this book that I liked
1:11:01
uh and I would have liked to have seen
1:11:03
more of. I think that's the biggest
1:11:04
problem. It's like
1:11:05
>> oh I wanted to see more of that. Oh, I
1:11:07
wanted to see more of this. Oh, I want
1:11:08
more of these characters. Um that how
1:11:11
can you be mad that you liked things
1:11:14
>> but at the same time I wanted more of
1:11:16
them than I got. So that is going to be
1:11:18
something I mention. I think one of my
1:11:20
favorite things about the book is seeing
1:11:21
Tyel again. We haven't seen him in quite
1:11:23
a while. And in Diablo, the original
1:11:26
Diablo I he gets a mention as being part
1:11:29
of the Harajum and having left. Having
1:11:32
left and I believe it's Donan who said
1:11:34
it seemed like he was afraid. He left
1:11:36
and he never came back. And it seemed
1:11:37
like he was afraid and
1:11:40
which seems weird if you know Tyel from
1:11:43
previous Diablo games, even Diablo II
1:11:45
when he became mortal. That seems weird.
1:11:48
What would scare Tyel? He was an
1:11:50
archangel. He's faced everything
1:11:52
Sanctuary has to throw out there. But in
1:11:55
this book, you get some characterization
1:11:57
of Tyel. We h that we've never seen.
1:11:59
We've never seen anything quite like
1:12:01
this looking into Tyel's head about how
1:12:04
he is uncertain. He's worried. He's made
1:12:06
the wrong choices. He is forgetting
1:12:11
things. He in his mortal body he's
1:12:13
incapable of remembering of
1:12:16
comprehending his long angelic life. So
1:12:20
I think it's really interesting to see
1:12:22
Tyel in this context uncertain but
1:12:25
trying his best and in particular
1:12:28
trying to seem like he has it together
1:12:32
for the rest of the Harajum.
1:12:35
So,
1:12:36
>> and also at the same time, yeah, at the
1:12:38
same time, he is the guy wearing fully
1:12:39
angelic armor and carrying elderly in
1:12:42
the sword of justice right up to people
1:12:44
like, "Oh, hello my fellow humans."
1:12:48
>> So, it's it's very interesting to see
1:12:50
the sight of Tyel, which we maybe saw a
1:12:53
little bit in Diablo III cuz he had kind
1:12:56
of funny conversations with Lorath about
1:12:58
how he was failing to be good at
1:13:00
humaning. Uh, but it's it's it's
1:13:02
interesting to see Ti like this. I again
1:13:04
I could have used some more I could have
1:13:06
used some more material time. Um and I
1:13:09
think it's a really interesting
1:13:10
characterization that we we didn't get
1:13:13
into in Diablo II. And
1:13:17
Diablo I just had a mention of him.
1:13:20
>> Indeed. Well, I think that's going to do
1:13:23
it for today though, friends. I do want
1:13:25
to remind you that Blizzard is made
1:13:27
possible due to your generous
1:13:28
contributions at
1:13:29
patreon.com/bizzardwatch.
1:13:31
Your continued support means that this
1:13:33
podcast site and community is able to
1:13:35
thrive and grow. Blizzard watch
1:13:38
supporters enjoy exclusive benefits like
1:13:40
early access to the podcast. A better
1:13:43
chance at having your question answered
1:13:44
on our podcast or the Q&A and answer
1:13:45
reset experience. If you have questions
1:13:48
for this or any of our podcast,
1:13:50
especially if you have any questions
1:13:51
about this book or Diablo lore, now is
1:13:53
probably a pretty good time to get those
1:13:54
in. You can send that into
1:13:56
podcastwatch.com.
1:13:59
specify the show that it is for in the
1:14:01
subject line as well as any special
1:14:03
pronunciation of your name. If you want
1:14:04
to throw those questions to us on
1:14:06
Discord, you can. Uh we have the Q and
1:14:08
podcast questions channel open for
1:14:10
everybody. Uh same rules apply. And if
1:14:12
you are a Patreon subscriber as an extra
1:14:14
bonus for helping us keep the lights on,
1:14:16
we have the patron Q and podcast
1:14:18
questions channel where we look there
1:14:20
first for anything you might send our
1:14:22
way. Uh I do want to thank you for
1:14:24
joining us on this journey and friends
1:14:27
we'll see you next week.