Good riddance, Midnight crest caps!

0:08
[music]
0:10
>> Hello everybody and welcome to the
0:11
Blizzard Watch podcast and don't be
0:13
confused. This is the actual podcast.
0:16
It's It really is. It's here right now.
0:18
This is it. Um so if you anyone tells
0:21
you it's some other podcast, I mean I
0:23
don't know why they would, but they're
0:24
wrong. Um I'm Matt. Uh with me this week
0:28
are my fantastic co-hosts um Liz Harper
0:31
who is basically the God Emperor of the
0:33
site and Joe Perez. I'm going to say
0:35
you're Who do you think you're more like
0:36
you um Oh, I can't remember his name but
0:39
uh the the the bald one with the the
0:40
black hair. No, black black skin. God,
0:44
I'm so tired.
0:45
Which one? I don't know.
0:48
>> [laughter]
0:48
>> I've managed to butcher that so hard.
0:50
But it's
0:51
Pick the primarch you would like to be.
0:53
Vulcan.
0:53
>> Oh, Vulcan. Yeah. Um hmm probably. I
0:58
mean it'd be nice. I'd be unkillable.
0:59
I'd like that. I'd like that a lot. Most
1:02
people would really. Uh and those that
1:04
don't probably have a really good reason
1:05
like that whole watching everyone you
1:07
love die over time. That that doesn't
1:09
sound great. But anyway, also besides
1:11
Liz being the God Emperor and Joe being
1:13
Vulcan, we have Corey who apparently
1:14
would know better than me who he would
1:16
be. Oh, don't don't ask me to choose.
1:18
How can you choose your favorite? Easy,
1:20
you pick the one that's your favorite.
1:22
Oh, okay. Anyway,
1:24
uh it's it's been wild. Um
1:27
I I have spent a lot of time playing
1:29
Diablo this week so
1:31
I'm
1:32
I'm like kind of at the point where I I
1:34
It's like you ever have that the Tetris
1:36
dream thing where you you actually have
1:39
Tetris dreams? I'm not kidding. This
1:40
happens. People who play a lot of Tetris
1:43
have the Tetris dream. And I'm like that
1:46
for the you know, the big window of how
1:50
to how to make runes do what you want is
1:52
just constantly in my head going, "Oh
1:54
God." And or the Paragon board. Oh, the
1:56
Paragon board. The Paragon board is
1:58
literally haunting my nightmares because
2:00
I keep looking at it going, "Oh, I could
2:02
get an extra 2% damage if I did this."
2:04
And then I wake up and I'm like, "What
2:05
was it? What was it? I don't remember
2:07
what it was." So, yeah. But,
2:09
we can talk about other things first.
2:11
Like example, we should be talking about
2:14
World of Warcraft. Uh first up, the
2:16
first news of the thing is basically
2:18
apparently they're getting rid of the
2:19
crest caps and they're they're going
2:21
now. THEY'RE GONE.
2:23
WE'RE FREE.
2:25
SURPRISE.
2:25
>> YEAH, good goodbye. You will not be
2:27
missed. Good riddance. Now, if we could
2:29
just have no more new currencies, just
2:31
keep using the same currency over and
2:32
over again so I can store it up. I I
2:34
mean, I'm going to I'm going to settle
2:35
on at least this time the currency made
2:38
sense and it the cap went away a lot
2:39
quicker than it did last time.
2:41
So, this is great news for everybody who
2:45
needs to upgrade stuff uh and has been
2:48
sitting there going, "I hate that I
2:50
can't get the stuff to max." Because
2:52
when I can't get every piece of gear to
2:54
that six out of six or whatever the cap
2:56
is for that piece of gear,
2:58
it drives me bonkers. So, now you can
3:00
fix that. I'm very happy about this.
3:03
>> [laughter]
3:04
>> Anyone else have a reaction to this one
3:05
before we move on? As always, it's
3:07
trying to save players from themselves
3:09
and from the grind that they'll they'll
3:12
feel like they're obligated to do. And
3:15
uh you know, on the one hand I get it,
3:17
but on the other hand
3:19
You're not my dad. Yeah, people are
3:21
going to be degens about the game
3:22
anyways. They're going to
3:24
if not on the main character, they'll
3:25
make an alt. And if not on the alt,
3:27
they'll make a second alt. And they're
3:28
just let them play. Hot take.
3:31
>> Well, I'm going to move on to the news
3:32
about the heroic world tier. Oh, no. Liz
3:35
is talking. Liz, go.
3:36
>> [laughter]
3:38
>> I mean, it's
3:40
it's it's a progression limiter, right?
3:43
So, no one is getting super far ahead
3:45
just because they're grinding forever.
3:47
So, I think on one hand Corey's right.
3:48
It is we're saving people from
3:50
themselves. But also, it's preventing
3:52
anyone from getting too far ahead of
3:55
anyone else. It's It's limiting kind of
3:57
that gear gap from people who are
3:59
playing casually and people who are
4:01
playing 24/7. So, I do think there's
4:05
some positives to having the cap, but
4:08
the further you get into the season, the
4:10
less necessary it feels and the more
4:13
annoying it feels. So, it's like
4:16
all in all, it's good. It is gone
4:19
forever until the next raid tier,
4:22
probably. And yes, I have a lot of I
4:25
have a lot of low-level crest that now
4:28
need to be converted up so I can
4:29
actually do something.
4:30
>> Okay. Um going to move on to the heroic
4:32
world tier news because it's not exactly
4:35
coming to World of Warcraft as a whole.
4:38
And I'd like Liz or to talk about it
4:41
because I feel like Liz can explain
4:43
exactly what's going on.
4:45
>> I mean, if you played in Legion Remix,
4:48
it did a thing called heroic world tier
4:50
where it's just
4:51
uh
4:52
things are harder. Kind of everything is
4:55
more difficult and more complicated. And
4:56
here,
4:58
it's similar. It's similar to that
5:01
heroic world tier and it's referred to
5:02
as heroic world tier in achievements on
5:05
the PTR.
5:06
Uh so, this is part of patch 12.0.7
5:10
and it will It's going to be available
5:12
in specific zones. So, probably
5:16
So, I mean, I think it's an interesting
5:18
addition. We've seen world tiers in
5:21
Diablo for a long time where you
5:22
increase the difficulty of the base
5:24
game, but it was only in Legion Remix
5:27
that we saw something like this in World
5:29
of Warcraft.
5:31
And
5:32
I think it's I think it's neat. I think
5:33
it's fun. It's just It's a little It's a
5:36
little difficulty boost for people who
5:38
want the difficulty boost and in
5:41
limited areas of the game. So, are we
5:45
thinking these are going to be in just
5:47
like the we only have the void showdowns
5:49
coming? Is it related to those or
5:51
something? I'm actually reading the
5:52
article, so I wanted to ask that. And I
5:54
mean, it looks like it's currently just
5:56
available in those void showdown zones.
5:59
But, you know, it's still in the PTR, so
6:01
we'll see how it develops if this is,
6:03
you know, it's final form.
6:06
Uh yeah. So, yeah, that's it. It's
6:08
It's interesting to see things coming in
6:11
the base game. Cory? I'd expect it to be
6:14
basically in everything going forward at
6:16
this point. If if it works, it'll
6:19
they'll look at it and say, "Oh, yeah,
6:20
this is 100% what we should be doing
6:22
now." and giving people that option to
6:24
take the base game and the base game
6:26
play and
6:27
play it at a level that
6:29
fits their play style or their gearing
6:32
or etc. Or at least comes closer to it
6:34
because obviously a mythic world first
6:36
raider isn't ever really going to get
6:37
any challenge from the world content.
6:40
Yeah. So, it does feel like Legion Remix
6:43
is kind of a test run to see, "Okay, can
6:45
we do this? How does it work? Do people
6:47
enjoy it?" And I think it got a pretty
6:49
positive response in Remix. So, now
6:52
they're doing it also on a small scale
6:54
here, which is probably technically I
6:57
bet it's easier to do on a small scale.
6:59
You can just set it up for this one
7:01
zone, and that's that's where it is.
7:03
Instead of going back and evaluating the
7:06
entire World of Warcraft to add a
7:09
difficulty level, which I imagine would
7:12
be a pretty significant project.
7:15
Yeah, and there's some zones like, you
7:16
know, leveling zones in general don't
7:18
really need you to have a heroic world
7:20
tier for them because they're not meant
7:22
for you to be in past a certain point.
7:25
Uh it's mostly
7:26
>> know. Maybe
7:27
like look, if we continue the Diablo
7:31
comparison, I mean, I level in like
7:35
Pentament usually because torment levels
7:38
are locked down a little more, but yeah,
7:40
I go in and take the take the XP boost
7:43
that Diablo offers for higher world
7:45
tiers. So,
7:46
you know, you could push yourself. If
7:48
you want to push yourself and you know,
7:50
there are lots of different kinds of
7:51
people playing World of Warcraft. So,
7:53
you're going to have those people who
7:54
are more casual and want a more chill
7:56
experience when they're leveling and
7:57
you're going to want those people you're
7:58
going to have those people who are like,
8:00
"I want something that's a little more
8:01
of a challenge. I want I want these
8:03
monsters to have an actual chance of
8:04
defeating me instead of like throwing
8:06
down one keg smash and everything is
8:08
dead, you know?" You're the opposite of
8:10
me. I want keg smash to kill everything.
8:12
I want it to be like God threw a keg at
8:14
them. I'm
8:15
I'm
8:16
I'm I'm kind of I'm kind of in between
8:18
and there are days when I'm my mood is I
8:19
just want to smash everything in front
8:21
of me and there are days when my mood
8:22
is, "Okay, I want to I want to maybe do
8:25
something a little harder for more
8:26
rewards."
8:28
Yeah, I can see that. I mean, I just
8:29
obviously I'm I'm sitting here pushing
8:31
torment seven. I'm almost in torment
8:34
eight. In fact, I've been running in
8:35
torment eight, but I I reserve the right
8:37
to jump back when it gets too hard. Oh,
8:39
no, it's Stewart, back to seven. Oh, no.
8:42
No backward step. You go forward, you're
8:43
forward. Backward steps are for wimps.
8:46
>> Commit. [laughter]
8:47
I refuse.
8:49
Uh I'm a coward, but regardless, I I do
8:51
think it's interesting to see how it
8:53
ends up shaking out if they put it in
8:55
for, you know, leveling content, older
8:57
zones,
8:59
or if it's it just the way they do stuff
9:01
is they tend to roll it out and then
9:03
make adjustments. Like transmog has had
9:05
a lot of adjustments over the years. So,
9:07
it could start as like this end game
9:09
only thing like in the void show downs
9:11
and then as time passes and they feel
9:14
like, "Okay, we've got a handle on
9:15
this." They may start bringing it out in
9:17
more and more places. We'll see.
9:19
Um but right now, I'm going to ask about
9:21
this one cuz I'm like
9:23
I was so excited and then I saw that the
9:26
tagline is that it doesn't actually
9:27
work. Um there's a new tool that allows
9:31
for automatic boss kill screenshots,
9:33
which is great, but apparently it's not
9:35
entirely working the way you want.
9:37
>> It's again, we should stress this is on
9:39
the PTR. This is on This is part of
9:41
patch 12.0.7
9:43
and it's in testing and it's a cool
9:45
idea. I but yeah, it's not 100%
9:50
on the PTR yet. So ostensibly they're
9:53
putting it on the PTR to test it and
9:55
improve it and hopefully it gets
9:58
uh
9:59
it gets there. I
10:01
have complicated feelings about this.
10:04
How about them?
10:05
>> So one, this was already solved in an
10:09
add-on that has existed since Wrath of
10:11
the Lich King that no longer works
10:14
because they killed all add-ons. They
10:17
didn't kill all the add-ons.
10:18
>> being I'm being salacious. I I I know.
10:22
Let me Liz, I need the we need the
10:24
engagement. Let me go.
10:26
>> [laughter]
10:28
>> But it it it did not survive the calling
10:31
and it solved this problem and did
10:34
everything that they're struggling to do
10:36
already. So part of the things that are
10:38
inconsistent with it is it just takes a
10:40
screenshot of whatever your screen is
10:42
and maybe it's the exact moment of the
10:44
kill, maybe it's after
10:46
the thing has fallen over, maybe it's
10:48
not, maybe it remembers to do it, maybe
10:49
it doesn't.
10:51
Maybe it will you know and but it will
10:53
always be your
10:56
exact screen including your UI. The
11:00
add-on took a screenshot without your
11:02
UI. And again, has been around since
11:05
Wrath of the Lich King.
11:06
So this is
11:08
not a problem that needed solving until
11:10
they made it a problem and then this
11:13
which they seem to have difficulty with
11:15
which again is a nice idea.
11:17
I like the concept of it but also do we
11:20
need
11:22
like this?
11:23
Is it something we need at this point?
11:26
There are still plenty of other bugs
11:27
that that maybe could be fixed up in the
11:29
patch.
11:30
>> Aw.
11:30
>> [sighs]
11:30
>> And again, it or there's maybe other
11:32
things that like to see added more than
11:34
maybe this camera. Like maybe more prey
11:37
hunts or something else. Especially in
11:40
an 07 patch where it's not a full like
11:43
content drop patch.
11:45
Like something
11:46
>> to be one of those
11:48
This has got to be one of those things
11:48
that it's one person's like
11:51
game jam project that they were like,
11:53
"Oh, actually this works. Let's let's
11:55
see if we can spool this up to full
11:57
production." Sure, or they sat there and
11:58
said maybe, "Hey, remember that add-on
12:00
that was really cool that already worked
12:01
that we broke? Let's let's make it
12:02
again." or something. Sure. I'm being
12:05
Again, I'm being salacious. Ah.
12:07
I mean, they they they
12:09
have done that before with integrating
12:11
add-on features into the game. And I
12:13
mean, it's a cool idea. It would be nice
12:14
something that would be neat to have
12:15
back if they make it work properly,
12:18
which it currently on the PTR does not.
12:22
Hopefully,
12:24
it will get there before release. But I
12:25
I feel like these 0.7 patches are the
12:27
perfect time for stuff like this for
12:29
little little, you know, little
12:31
what's-its to be added to the game.
12:33
Plus, if it doesn't work on a 0.7 patch,
12:36
that's not new content. You know what I
12:39
mean? People aren't aren't raiding brand
12:40
new bosses and want their little thing
12:43
to work properly. They'll They're going
12:45
to be like, "Well, you know, I wanted it
12:47
to to do the thing. I I had a fun idea
12:49
to go to Molten Core and kill all the
12:51
bosses like in a hat."
12:53
Um but you know, I I didn't get all the
12:55
screenshots, but still, you know, it's
12:56
cool. Now they can try and fix it before
12:59
the the real and the new raid content
13:01
comes. Uh we'll see. I I am
13:03
I am not probably going to be using this
13:05
because I'm I have not been killing any
13:08
raid bosses in WoW and I doubt I will
13:10
be. I've just barely started building a
13:11
house.
13:12
Um although my little house is so sad
13:16
and empty.
13:17
Uh but that's my fault. Um
13:19
>> Every little house has to start
13:20
somewhere. Yeah, and I I started like
13:22
months behind. So, yeah, I'm I'm working
13:24
on it. Uh my little house is at least
13:27
it's green.
13:28
Did you say your little house is a very,
13:29
very fine house? No, I wouldn't.
13:32
No.
13:32
>> It's Is it in the middle of the street?
13:34
No. No, it's not. It's actually on a
13:36
plot.
13:37
>> [laughter]
13:38
>> See, I The worst part is I love that
13:39
song. So, I'm sitting there going
13:44
and I got to stop myself.
13:46
Um, let's talk about Mists of Pandaria
13:49
Classic because
13:51
why not? Um,
13:53
Mists of Pandaria Classic is in phase
13:54
five, which means Siege of Orgrimmar,
13:56
which means we'll come back next year
13:58
and they'll still be there. It is not in
14:01
phase five. Phase five is is launching
14:03
in June, on June 2nd.
14:05
>> Ah, June 2nd. And I thought that was in
14:07
June.
14:07
>> they
14:08
They It's a couple weeks. We got a
14:09
couple weeks. Yes, calm down everybody.
14:11
I was wrong. Um, but I will say this.
14:14
Um, the tagline here of let's hope it
14:16
lasts less than 18 months is a joke cuz
14:19
we all remember it and haha, it it took
14:20
a long time, but at the same time,
14:21
please God, don't take it. Um, I that
14:25
that 18 months in Siege of Orgrimmar It
14:27
was actually a good raid. I think we can
14:29
say that, right? It was a good raid.
14:31
It was
14:32
>> Throne of Thunder as good as Throne
14:33
>> Yeah. I I was the most raiding I've ever
14:36
done in my life because open raid
14:38
existed at that time. And so, basically
14:40
on Saturdays, all I did was raid.
14:43
And I had four or five characters that
14:45
were clearing heroic, and I had two or
14:47
three that were clearing mythic when
14:49
mythic got added. So, I saw a lot of
14:51
Siege of Orgrimmar. And it was a good
14:52
raid. It just wasn't Throne of Thunder
14:54
good. Uh, I think it was just not
14:56
Whether or not you think it was as good
14:57
as Throne of Thunder, I think it was as
14:59
good as Throne of Thunder. My my hot
15:00
take, I think it was better than Throne
15:02
of Thunder.
15:03
Ooh, I disagree cuz Lei Shen is a
15:05
perfect fight. No No raid could ever
15:08
survive being the content for 18 months.
15:12
No.
15:13
>> Yeah, I think so. No.
15:14
>> Like, if if you look back on Mists of
15:17
Pandaria, it is one of the best
15:19
expansions World of Warcraft has ever
15:21
done. It had presented these
15:23
widely varied environments. The raids
15:26
all The raids and dungeons all had a
15:28
really unique feel and took us to really
15:30
different places.
15:32
Um and it had it had really good
15:34
stories. It had some of
15:37
uh the early uses of phasing technology
15:39
that really made it feel like you had an
15:41
impact on the world around you as you
15:43
were playing through the stuff. I like I
15:45
don't agree with all of the story
15:46
decisions, but looking back this is
15:49
really great expansion. But while you
15:52
were playing it in the moment, you get
15:55
to the end and it's like uh this is 18
15:57
months and all I got to do is Siege of
15:59
Orgrimmar
16:00
endlessly and Timeless Isles. You know
16:03
what's interesting? frogs Hm.
16:06
Hellfire Citadel was actually longer as
16:08
far as a raid tier goes like kind of
16:10
like time-wise between content than
16:12
Siege of Orgrimmar. Why do we not hate
16:15
Hellfire Citadel as much as Siege of
16:16
Orgrimmar?
16:17
>> The entire expansion got bagged on. It's
16:19
not like they're going to
16:20
Well, look. I was I was looking at I was
16:22
looking at data cuz Liz loves I know Liz
16:24
loves actual factual data. Um Wait, yes.
16:27
>> I read chat, Liz. Um Mhm. Siege Siege of
16:31
Orgrimmar was 511 days. Hellfire Citadel
16:34
was 574.
16:36
Yeah, but I I I was serious when I made
16:38
that statement. People were already
16:40
upset with the pacing and length of
16:42
content releases in Warlords of Draenor.
16:46
They felt like the expansion was
16:47
truncated. They felt like you know, they
16:50
they were just nothing for long patches.
16:52
Um nothing new and then the next thing
16:54
would come and then boom, they dropped
16:55
it this big long raid on it. People
16:58
didn't have the positive feeling that
17:00
they had for Mists of Pandaria. People I
17:03
remember talking to like random people
17:05
who were talking about how much they
17:06
were enjoying Mists of Pandaria and how
17:08
much the content was coming out at a
17:10
really fast pace.
17:12
Yeah, that was the
17:13
77-day kind of Yeah, like like literally
17:16
January, the next thing, then you know,
17:18
March, the next thing. And when it
17:21
suddenly came out with Siege of
17:23
Orgrimmar, and it just it felt like
17:25
hitting a wall. Because at first
17:27
everyone was loving it, and then
17:28
everyone had cleared it at least on
17:30
normal.
17:31
And they did that thing where they, you
17:33
know, the the Siege of Orgrimmar patch
17:35
was also the patch that changed rating,
17:36
right? Yes.
17:38
>> Like they added mythic and had like a
17:40
rate they had the flexing on the
17:42
you know, so
17:44
everyone was like thrown off, and then
17:47
that was it for a very long time. I
17:50
remember like clearing mythic
17:53
Siege of Orgrimmar on the raid guild I
17:54
was in, leaving that guild, going to a
17:57
different guild, and like I was back in
18:01
Siege of Orgrimmar heroic getting them
18:03
up so they could start running mythic,
18:04
and then I went back to my old guild
18:07
after I helped that guild get to it
18:08
because my eyesight was really starting
18:10
to bother me, and my old guild was like,
18:11
"Hey, you just want to DPS?" So I was
18:13
like, "Okay." Yeah, I I I did a lot of
18:15
of a lot of Siege because that was the
18:18
raid tier that I also changed guilds. So
18:22
I had that massive falling out of the
18:24
guild that Matt and I were in at one
18:26
point in time.
18:26
>> Yeah. Um for reasons that are not
18:29
suitable for broadcast, and uh I moved
18:32
over to the current guild, and like I
18:36
wound up going through Siege of
18:38
Orgrimmar Orgrimmar twice with basically
18:42
once with the first group, and then then
18:44
again with the current guild.
18:46
But I don't know. Like I I get I get
18:48
what everybody says. Like I understand
18:50
there's some there's some heat there
18:51
because of the story, especially if you
18:53
were a horde character, it felt bad
18:55
sieging Orgrimmar. Um there wasn't a lot
18:58
of like feel-good payoffs, and you
19:01
didn't really feel like you accomplished
19:02
much. Uh I I know people feel like that.
19:05
I thoroughly just enjoyed the like I
19:10
guess I don't want to say the immersion,
19:11
but the the the
19:13
reveals of how much was actually
19:16
underneath Orgrimmar, if that makes
19:17
sense.
19:18
Like Mhm. having that like complex
19:22
network of like machinery and production
19:27
and how big those spaces were because
19:30
it's something that even now we have
19:33
never talked about again.
19:35
And it's like the implications of that
19:37
is that like cavernous space that they
19:39
found that was left over like
19:40
Hollowfall? Or is there a relation to
19:43
when Y'Shaarj got ripped out of Azeroth?
19:46
But it got my mind spinning. So like I
19:48
didn't mind going through there because
19:50
it was like just one of those cool
19:52
little things for for me that I I I
19:55
guess
19:56
I just liked.
19:57
Um
19:57
>> I'm sorry, no one's talking about how
19:59
cool Gamon was in that raid.
20:01
Gamon will save us.
20:04
He You know, I'm I also say I I'm pretty
20:08
sure
20:09
that that stuff was all was all
20:10
excavated out by Garrosh based on the
20:13
fact that they say I think they say that
20:15
a couple times and there's a couple
20:16
digging machines down there. Yeah, but
20:18
regardless Yeah, but yeah yeah yeah
20:20
yeah.
20:21
Um
20:22
I think it You know, like I said, I've
20:23
I've never had a problem. I get what
20:25
you're saying about the story. Like if
20:26
you're Horde, it's like, "Yeah, I get to
20:28
destroy my own capital city and kill my
20:31
own leaders. Woo!"
20:32
>> Listen. For the Horde!
20:33
>> I would be
20:35
I would be happy to destroy more of
20:36
Orgrimmar because I I don't like new
20:39
Orgrimmar. Let's Let's go back and let's
20:43
I will say the worst thing about that
20:44
tier is that it took me over 400 days to
20:46
get the Dark Shaman transmog. That's a
20:48
That's a pretty big mark against it.
20:50
Yeah.
20:50
Uh
20:52
but you know, I understand that new
20:55
Orgrimmar has now been in the game
20:57
longer than old Orgrimmar and I'm still
21:00
like
21:01
I I still hate it. I don't have to like
21:03
it. I I I have hated it for many years
21:07
and I will continue to hate it. So, yes,
21:09
let's go and let's go into Siege of
21:11
Orgrimmar,
21:12
tear it down, and rebuild. I think that
21:15
would I'm totally fine with that
21:17
personally. Regardless, I do think for
21:19
Mr. Panda Classic, you know, guys, this
21:22
is good content. It just It took too
21:25
long the first time. You probably won't
21:26
be in it for 18 months, so I'm going to
21:29
say go and explore it cuz yeah, it's
21:31
fun.
21:32
>> Plus, I mean, go ahead, Liz. I
21:35
It was just kind of ruined by that
21:36
timing because by the by the time we
21:39
were in new content, we were exhausted
21:41
of Siege of Orgrimmar. So, I think
21:44
ostensibly if you went in and you change
21:46
you change the pacing, which Classic has
21:47
done,
21:49
uh you can make it can be a lot of fun.
21:51
It can be a lot of fun cuz you know
21:52
there's something else cool around the
21:53
corner that you can go into.
21:55
I think it's interesting that around the
21:57
time
21:58
that this is getting to the point where
21:59
I would consider it old.
22:01
Um cuz this is coming out in June. I
22:03
think 6 months down the road is usually
22:05
when I start feeling like are we going
22:06
to keep doing this for another like
22:08
another couple months?
22:09
We're going to have BlizzCon.
22:10
>> Yeah, and that's and that's always the
22:12
trap with like end of expansion content
22:14
too, which they've gotten better about.
22:16
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
22:17
Every single end of expansion raid we've
22:21
ever had
22:22
has basically I don't want to say
22:25
overstayed its welcome,
22:27
but gotten really close to it because of
22:29
the time between like expansions or
22:31
in the case of like even vanilla WoW,
22:35
uh how many people actually got to run
22:37
AQ40 and how many people actually got to
22:39
run 40-man Naxxramas?
22:41
Right? Like a fraction of a fraction.
22:43
Yeah, like a Not a lot of people. Like a
22:45
fraction of a fraction, so like for them
22:47
the drought was even longer.
22:49
And like yeah, you could do the other
22:50
content, but like you those are like the
22:52
big end game raids that you know, these
22:55
are the capstones and they were
22:56
difficult and like getting through them
22:58
was a pain, uh but you know, air quote
23:00
rewarding.
23:02
Um
23:02
And then like you compare that to
23:04
Burning Crusade and you know, when we
23:07
finish out there and then going to Wrath
23:09
of the Lich King and Icecrown Citadel,
23:11
it feels great to get to the end of it,
23:13
but then when you're at at the end of
23:15
it, like they started to learn
23:17
add more stuff to the game
23:20
to soften the blow.
23:22
Burning Crusade was weird though because
23:24
it had the Isle of Quel'Danas and then
23:26
it had
23:27
the Sunwell. Yeah, which is also a raid
23:29
that like a fraction of a fraction got
23:31
to experience.
23:32
Yeah, but it they threw it in there and
23:34
it was like what? So we're like I don't
23:37
think anyone expected there to be a raid
23:38
past Black Temple.
23:40
They thought Black Temple was going to
23:41
be the end. It made sense. It was
23:42
Illidan. We figured, okay, that's the
23:44
end and then boom, entire entire
23:46
>> man on the box. WE GOT TO KILL THE MAN
23:48
ON THE BOX.
23:49
YEAH, SO I think there was a bit of
23:51
surprise there, but you know, Sunwell
23:53
had its own problems not to not just the
23:55
duration thing, but the fact that entire
23:57
class that was tanking suddenly couldn't
23:59
tank it.
24:00
>> Or or the fact that like most most
24:03
people that experienced it at the time
24:04
of current content didn't actually fight
24:07
any of the bosses. They just went in to
24:08
farm BOE
24:11
drops from like the first like five
24:13
trash packs which were already brutal
24:15
enough.
24:16
Like
24:17
>> I I knew one guild that was would run
24:19
right up to Kalecgos and then stop. Like
24:22
it for for weeks
24:24
they were doing that. They were just
24:26
killing up to Kalecgos on the off chance
24:28
some BOEs would drop and then they'd
24:30
reset because they didn't want to
24:32
actually try to kill him because they
24:33
knew they didn't have the gear for it.
24:35
And and then
24:36
and you had the and then you had the
24:37
tanks like having to farm PvP gear to
24:39
have the resilience in order to survive
24:40
the hits from it. Yeah, especially
24:42
druids. Cuz they got they got
24:45
I got to go ahead. Go ahead. No, I was
24:46
going to say my my point though is like
24:48
looking at the different raid tiers and
24:49
all the end game raids or the end
24:53
expansion raids
24:54
most of them had other things to do once
24:58
we got past tier 16.
25:00
Right? So, tier 16 was Siege of
25:02
Orgrimmar. And maybe that's why it felt
25:05
so long, too, is that there wasn't a
25:07
whole lot of extra stuff to do cuz if
25:09
you did everything, you were just done.
25:12
Uh challenge mode dungeons were okay,
25:14
but they weren't the the mythic plus
25:16
dungeons we had now. So, they weren't
25:18
really finely tuned. A lot of people
25:19
were just not wanting to experience
25:21
them. Only a small fraction of a
25:23
fraction were doing that. And then by
25:25
the time you get to tier 18, Hellfire
25:26
Citadel,
25:28
even though Warlords of Draenor uh it's
25:31
really hard for me not to call it War
25:32
Dads. Um but Warlords of Draenor,
25:35
even though it was not well received,
25:38
had a had more stuff to do than, you
25:41
know, Siege of Orgrimmar. It's just that
25:43
>> Hellfire Peninsula was was a lot of
25:46
content.
25:46
>> Yeah. And then look at everything that
25:48
came after that, too. Like, you know,
25:49
Ny'alotha, the Waking City, we spent 10
25:51
months in there.
25:52
Um at the Battle of Azeroth, but there's
25:54
so much to do in in Battle for Azeroth
25:57
that it didn't really make a big
25:59
difference. Antorus, the Burning Throne,
26:01
9 months there. So much to do in Legion
26:04
that like and things to farm and
26:05
dungeons and and other stuff. So, like,
26:08
the impact of it feels I and maybe this
26:11
is just me speculating, but I think
26:13
maybe that's what softened the blow for
26:15
some of these later ones or like in the
26:17
case cuz there was just other stuff to
26:18
do. When Siege of Orgrimmar was was out,
26:22
there really wasn't.
26:23
Not yet.
26:25
We were getting there.
26:25
>> closest we had was the barren stuff, and
26:27
that was the previous batch. Yeah. By
26:29
that time everybody had farmed their
26:31
their tier, you know, the dungeon set to
26:35
look alike sets. Everyone had already
26:36
done it, so. Uh but yeah, we're going to
26:38
move on because we've talked a lot about
26:40
this. And now we're going to talk about
26:42
Diablo really quickly. Except this one
26:44
will probably be long. Um cuz I have
26:47
Uh
26:47
our first point in this, go ahead. Uh
26:49
Diablo 4 season 13 ends June 30th, and
26:53
season 14 is expected to launch the same
26:55
day. No details on what will be in
26:57
season 14 and all relic queries
26:59
including the Azaroth relic query will
27:00
be gone then as well. So basically we're
27:02
telling you that you have about a month,
27:04
I guess a month and 2 weeks.
27:06
Uh so 6 weeks to get your season journey
27:10
as done as you feel like you're going to
27:11
get it. Uh if you want something on the
27:13
on the relic queries
27:14
uh and you've been holding off on
27:16
getting it, get it. Uh but you know,
27:19
you've got 6 weeks so you don't have to
27:20
panic. Well, it's just this is a this is
27:23
we're launching into the new expansion
27:24
with a really short season that really
27:26
didn't have a theme. So I'm curious as
27:28
to what they're coming up with next.
27:30
Yeah.
27:30
>> And if it's is it going to be more of
27:31
the same? Because I was I'm honestly
27:33
kind of tired of the same. Oh, it's
27:35
going to I I would put money on it being
27:38
more of the same, but
27:39
>> Uh-huh. I don't want it to be more of
27:40
the same. I remain optimistic that they
27:43
could surprise us. I I'm hopeful, but I
27:45
mean I was telling Matt about this in
27:47
before we started recording even in the
27:48
pre-show. Like this is some of the most
27:52
engaged I've been in Diablo in a long
27:54
while.
27:55
Like Diablo 4 specifically. Diablo 2 is
27:57
always I I will always go back to to you
27:59
know, that's over like um
28:01
but like this is the the longest that
28:03
I've stayed engaged with Diablo 4 after
28:06
beating the main story line. Like I
28:08
didn't just like you know, saunter off
28:10
to Narnia afterwards. No, I'm still
28:12
there. Um like I
28:15
I I think I was talking about this in
28:17
in raid or or possibly I think we were
28:19
talking about it a little bit on lore
28:21
watch at the beginning. Like the season
28:23
not having a theme
28:25
I'm oddly better with than most of the
28:28
themes that they've put out before for
28:30
for Diablo 4.
28:32
And the fact that it happened at a time
28:33
where I'm farming you know, favors to
28:36
spend on Azaroth transmog helps a lot.
28:42
Um and then stuff like uh and I I I
28:45
mentioned this to you while you were
28:46
were here.
28:48
One of the things that's really captured
28:49
me is I like war plans. I I like that a
28:51
lot. It gives me It gives me like in in
28:56
Anybody who's played Diablo II, this
28:58
will probably resonate with you.
28:59
It reminds me of doing bail runs. Like
29:02
you have a specific set of objectives
29:04
that you need to hit to get to the end
29:06
and get your reward, and that was bail
29:09
runs for me. And I cannot tell you how
29:12
many bail runs I did, but I know it was
29:14
enough to burn through three physical
29:16
CDs of like Diablo II, and and this is
29:21
scratching that same itch, right? Um and
29:24
yes, I know progression feels slow in a
29:25
lot of these systems, but I don't know
29:27
that I necessarily mind that. That's
29:29
>> think progression feeling slow is bad
29:32
cuz progression was too fast. Like I
29:34
think they have the progression pretty
29:36
well in place right now.
29:37
Um Liz Liz has often said that this is
29:40
the best the game has ever been. I agree
29:42
with her.
29:43
>> It's absolutely true. But one of the
29:44
things I think is interesting about war
29:46
plans is that it showed them being smart
29:49
enough not to add a ton of new end game
29:53
system.
29:54
>> Right away, yeah. They kind of added a
29:57
ton of new end game systems here, I mean
29:59
they kind of did, yeah.
30:02
But I would argue I would argue that
30:03
this and I was talking with Matt about
30:05
this
30:06
and I think I said this a few weeks ago
30:08
here
30:09
I've had to relearn a lot of the game.
30:12
And like we acclimate ourselves
30:14
>> has has turned itself upside down and
30:17
inside out and one of the biggest
30:19
difficulties of the game is it does this
30:21
like every patch cycle. It's been
30:23
radically changing systems and I feel
30:26
like, okay, I'm going to Diablo IV is
30:28
great. It's in a great state right now.
30:30
It's really fun. The end game has a
30:32
little more organization and structures
30:34
with with structure with war plans,
30:36
which are also super rewarding and easy
30:38
to jump in and out of if you have like
30:40
20 minutes to play, jump in and do a war
30:42
plan. You get a ton of rewards and you
30:44
can move through it quickly and it feels
30:46
just really active and engaged. The game
30:49
is great right now.
30:50
I also think it has taken Diablo
30:53
launched not as great as this and it's
30:56
taken 2 years to really develop it into
30:59
a full game which is fun start to
31:01
finish. Yeah, and and my counter
31:02
argument to and I I shouldn't say my
31:04
counter argument, my addition to that
31:05
though is this is also the easiest I've
31:08
had relearning
31:09
if that makes sense. Because yeah,
31:11
there's a lot there, but they do a much
31:14
much better job at laying it out. I'm
31:16
not saying it's perfect. I'm not even
31:18
going to remotely try to claim that. But
31:20
from somebody who's having to relearn a
31:21
bunch of stuff,
31:23
it it feels easier and I don't know if
31:26
that's like, you know, the placebo
31:29
effect, but I haven't really had a hard
31:31
time like understanding what to do with
31:33
the new stuff that that's here, which I
31:35
think is great.
31:36
Um I'm sure I'm sure that not
31:38
everybody's having that same experience
31:39
and I apologize if they're they're not,
31:41
but that's where I'm at. I just thought
31:43
it was it was noteworthy. Well, I'm
31:45
going to say one thing that since Liz
31:46
said, you know, it's it's better like to
31:49
level it's I'm just going to say this. I
31:51
when I did the season, I didn't jump
31:53
immediately
31:54
into a new season character and then
31:56
jump immediately to Scosglen.
31:59
I leveled through both the original
32:01
campaign and Vessel of Hatred before I
32:04
went to Scosglen and then I went to
32:06
Scosglen on that character and cleared
32:08
and did all the content there. It holds
32:10
together as a game a lot better than I
32:14
did.
32:15
Um I I mean, part part of the big
32:18
problem with Vessel of Hatred is that it
32:19
just dropped it. You know, it got it's
32:24
Yeah, it's an act two, but it got right
32:25
to the interesting bit of the story and
32:27
then it's like, okay, we're over. Come
32:28
back in 2 years.
32:30
Yeah, um I will actually say that that
32:32
is one of the things that I think is
32:34
really fixed. Um but I also have a
32:37
little a couple problems with There's
32:38
some story choices I didn't like and
32:40
some I did. But I
32:42
mechanically speaking, just playing the
32:44
game, not talking about the quality of
32:46
the storytelling, just as a game that I
32:48
am playing, it was so much easier
32:52
to go from 1 to 70 and to go into
32:55
Paragon and to and to get like get
32:58
myself started on the path I wanted to
33:00
go for end game this time. Like I've I
33:03
very rarely
33:05
start a character when I start a new
33:07
season, I very rarely start a character
33:09
and and go through all of it. Like up
33:12
through Vessel of Hatred was the the
33:13
last expansion. I usually do about I'd
33:16
go kill Lilith, I'd basically start and
33:18
get up to the point where you kill
33:19
Lilith, and then I go, "Okay, get me to
33:21
the end of this. I I've seen the only
33:23
part I really care about. I don't I
33:25
don't want to get mad at Errol again." I
33:27
I don't need that that moment of just
33:29
"You idiot. Are you Are you Are you an
33:31
idiot? Yes, you're
33:33
So,
33:34
I I thought it was it was a lot easier
33:37
to take when, as you point out, we get
33:39
the next part. Like with Lord of Hatred
33:42
being there,
33:43
but Lord of Hatred also feels like a
33:45
much better expansion
33:46
um because it feels like you
33:48
you know
33:49
>> the second half of that story. You get
33:50
the whole story instead of just You
33:52
don't feel you you don't feel at any
33:54
point like Vessel of Hatred doesn't it
33:57
doesn't complete conclude. It feels like
33:59
yes, there's more coming, more evils
34:01
will come, but this here is an ending.
34:04
This is an actual ending. You've
34:06
succeeded in in at least for a long time
34:10
preventing Mephisto from being a
34:11
problem. And then there's like enough
34:14
story stuff after There's enough after
34:17
you beat Mephisto's story
34:19
that sets up new things, and I'm hoping
34:22
to get to talk about them on Lore Watch
34:23
at some point. But you don't need to
34:25
hear me babble on about that right now.
34:27
But I will say that they're there, and
34:29
that's something that Vessel of Hatred
34:30
did not have. If Vessel of Hatred had
34:32
had quests afterwards like we are
34:34
needing Mephisto to go, what's going on,
34:37
you know, helping Neirel figure some
34:38
things out, it might have felt
34:40
>> guy wandering around that says he's
34:42
Akarat? Yeah, well, we knew that. Yeah.
34:45
Well, I mean, yeah, but like I mean, we
34:46
knew that, but we didn't see anything of
34:48
what he was up to until we jumped, you
34:51
know,
34:52
um ahead into Lord of Hatred. Yeah,
34:54
absolutely.
34:56
It just felt It felt like
34:58
I feel like you can do an expansion
35:00
that's kind of uh that feels like a
35:03
whole story.
35:06
And and Vessel didn't feel like a whole
35:08
story. It felt like
35:10
a chapter. It It Exactly.
35:12
>> a long wait until the next chapter. And
35:14
that's what made it feel bad. Like we
35:16
were just talking about Mists of
35:18
Pandaria. And part of the reason it felt
35:20
bad was because you got stuck in this
35:22
end part for so long. And Vessel was
35:25
kind of the same way. You got stuck at
35:27
this chapter of the story, and then
35:29
there's no follow-through for for over a
35:31
year. Yeah, I would also say that
35:33
Nahantu is a really It's a good zone.
35:37
There's nothing wrong with it as a zone
35:38
to play through.
35:39
But
35:40
you get kind of like I think Temys is
35:43
much better example of how to do a city
35:45
where, you know, you can go to other
35:46
cities if you want to, but you don't
35:48
have to.
35:49
I felt like really annoyed when I had to
35:51
go to Nahantu to to do the pit.
35:54
Because I never had to go to Nahantu for
35:55
anything else.
35:56
And that they had not the pit, uh
35:58
Corrupted Under City. The pit was up in
36:00
um Serengar, which is
36:02
>> yeah. Oh god, why are these things so
36:04
far apart? Why can't they both be some
36:06
place? I I like that they they did that.
36:09
I like that they gave us Temys and you
36:11
can go there and so forth. Also, it's
36:12
pretty. Temys is very pretty. Skovos is
36:14
very pretty. Nahantu had too much of you
36:17
can't see anything anyway because it's
36:19
dark and there's, you know, evil
36:22
branches blocking the sun and it gets to
36:24
a point where you're like, okay, I get
36:26
it. I get it. Okay, it's the corrupted
36:28
areas. We got We got it. You can You can
36:30
lighten up on that. And Scosglen does
36:31
have corrupted areas, but it lightens up
36:33
on it. I actually really like Scosglen
36:35
feels more like a Diablo III zone to me,
36:37
and I like that.
36:37
>> Really? If I was going to say it feels
36:39
like a Diablo II zone to me. Yeah, but
36:41
I'm talking the color palette. Oh, yeah.
36:44
I don't see cuz there's a lot of There
36:47
was a lot of talk about how Diablo III
36:49
was just colorful and it didn't have
36:51
that gothic tone that the rest of the
36:54
Diablo franchise had, and I I don't
36:58
really agree with that. Diablo What
37:00
Diablo III had, way more than Diablo II,
37:04
was color contrast. It wasn't always
37:08
using It's not like a bright neon
37:10
canvas, except for Whimsyshire, which is
37:13
intentionally a bright neon canvas. Is
37:15
that it?
37:17
But it was
37:18
>> [gasps]
37:19
>> it had sharp color contrast that made
37:22
the scenes pop, and Diablo IV has taken
37:25
a completely different direction and
37:27
made very muted color palettes that are
37:30
low contrast. They feel they can feel
37:34
very oppressive. That's the mood they're
37:36
trying to get, and it does a great job
37:38
of conveying that. It feels like
37:40
Sanctuary is a place of despair and
37:43
hopelessness where everything is going
37:46
wrong. You feel that in it. The
37:49
environmental design is beautiful. It's
37:50
very striking, but you feel that in
37:53
everywhere you walk through. This is not
37:55
a happy place. This is not a good place
37:58
that you're in. And Scosglen doesn't
38:00
have that. Scosglen has some bright
38:04
colors. It has high color contrast with
38:07
and some color saturation with like the
38:09
bright blue sea, the uh white buildings
38:13
everywhere. You get It feels alive in a
38:18
way the rest of Sanctuary does not, and
38:20
I think that's that's all in the art
38:22
design. It's all in the color palette
38:26
and because of that I think it feels
38:29
a lot better to be in Scovos. It just
38:34
the mood is higher even though things
38:36
are things are pretty bad. Things are
38:38
pretty bad everywhere.
38:39
>> Scovos actually does a really
38:41
interesting thing that that it's typical
38:43
in it's it's atypical in horror but it's
38:45
noted enough that people talk about it.
38:47
This concept of sunlit horror where
38:50
everything isn't night time, it isn't
38:51
always like you expect there to be
38:53
creatures out in the darkness but when
38:56
you're on a like like a sandy beach next
38:59
to the like effective like the the
39:01
sanctuary version of the Mediterranean
39:03
and suddenly drowned monstrosities come
39:06
pouring out of the water and throwing
39:08
grappling hooks up on things to go kill
39:10
everybody and you're like, "Okay, this
39:12
is not the beach vacation I was
39:14
promised." But at the same time at least
39:16
it feels
39:18
distinct. Um there is there are places
39:20
in in D4 where it's straight up it's
39:23
just nightmare fuel. There's nothing
39:24
that makes you feel better about being
39:26
there. It's like, "Oh my word.
39:28
Uh I really wish I wasn't in whatever
39:30
this is." But there's also that I think
39:33
the contrast is a really good point. Um
39:36
go ahead. I I think I let Joe talk.
39:37
>> Yeah, I was just going to say one of the
39:38
things that immediately made me or made
39:40
me think of was
39:42
uh
39:42
Grecian horror like Greece based horror.
39:46
Like it's got that Mediterranean bright
39:49
like the white walls and then you got
39:51
the areas where like the ichor is is
39:54
been caked in and dripping. Um like it's
39:58
it's got the stuff where things are just
39:59
slightly off. Um like it does really
40:03
really really well at like capturing
40:06
that uh weirdly uneasy feeling in what
40:09
would normally be in like an idyllic uh
40:11
field type feel. So I'm really here for
40:14
it and I just I absolutely love it. Like
40:16
I got to point out one thing that I
40:18
noticed. Uh I don't know if you guys
40:19
have noticed. Do you guys do the pit
40:21
very often?
40:22
At least once a day at this point.
40:24
>> You kind of have to. Do you ever notice
40:26
>> want you to do it. They're they're
40:28
getting you You were going through it
40:30
every five levels. You'll hear your
40:32
character will be like, "Something's
40:33
following me." If you look for it,
40:35
there's usually something to click on
40:37
that you can read
40:38
>> something to click on. Yeah.
40:40
>> Yes. There's always something. It's
40:43
progressing.
40:43
>> hear that. Yes. And when I got up to
40:45
like 60, he started saying, "Wait, I was
40:48
a Horadrim." And I'm like, "What?" Let's
40:51
Yeah, we'll we'll stop. Yeah, we'll stop
40:53
there. But my point is just he's giving
40:55
you more and more information. And a
40:57
friend of mine who's finished it told me
40:59
what it is. I'm not saying it. I'm
41:01
keeping it to myself but
41:01
>> If you want to If anyone wants to find
41:03
it, you can look at it on YouTube, the
41:05
uh pit story. Yeah, but it's just cool
41:08
to me that the pit finally has a story
41:09
attached to it.
41:10
>> I like the tiny story but yes. I I I
41:13
like that too. And I also like the
41:14
implications of it which we're going to
41:16
talk about on Lore Watch at some point.
41:17
Um
41:18
>> [clears throat]
41:18
>> which
41:18
>> especially when they combine it with the
41:20
tower. Yeah, oh yeah.
41:23
Yeah. And and the idea that a certain
41:26
And the idea that a certain NPC
41:29
may be geared up to make a return as a
41:32
result of that. Yep.
41:33
>> Ah, come on. You you knew that NPC was
41:36
not gone. Oh, yeah, we do. But we didn't
41:39
know he was going to come back.
41:41
>> [laughter]
41:41
>> Like he might have just, you know,
41:43
nope'd out and and taken himself
41:45
somewhere. What's really fascinating is
41:47
how they tied him in to the end of the
41:50
expansion. Like there's specific moments
41:53
where they tie him in. That's all I'm
41:54
saying. I'm not going to say anything
41:56
more. But regardless, I like that the
41:59
the the the there's a brightness to it
42:01
and a feeling of triumph but it's never
42:04
It's kind of like at the end you still
42:06
know it's Sanctuary. Like like the the
42:08
the equivalent of a colossal triumph in
42:10
Sanctuary is we fought a successful
42:13
holding action, but it's a really good
42:15
holding action this time. This will hold
42:17
them longer.
42:18
Every everything everything we've ever
42:21
done in every Diablo game is a holding
42:23
action. Everything. Even if you go back
42:26
to the prehistory of Diablo
42:28
and you know, the soul stones from day
42:31
one. This is a holding action. They
42:33
aren't designed to be like a permanent
42:35
storage solution. I think that's what
42:38
makes us so cool though. Right? Like
42:40
it's it's the first time we've got a
42:41
break of that cycle. Like I don't want
42:43
to ruin like I don't want to ruin
42:46
I don't want to ruin everything but it's
42:47
it's it's just it's fascinating to me.
42:49
Yeah, and the idea that you know,
42:51
whatever we see next will be different.
42:53
There's more but I want to show you what
42:55
I want to say. Liz, can I get you to do
42:56
the site news so that we can then talk
42:58
about other stuff without feeling
42:59
rushed?
43:00
>> [laughter]
43:03
>> Is that what you think we're doing?
43:04
Okay.
43:05
I I I just want to say thank you to all
43:07
of our supporters out there on the
43:09
internet. I I really appreciate you. You
43:12
guys who show up every week to listen to
43:13
us, to read the website. You are the
43:16
ones that keep us going and I certainly
43:20
a special thank you to our supporters on
43:22
Patreon because that financial support
43:25
really allows the site to keep going.
43:27
Obviously, there are ads on the site,
43:28
there are ads on the podcast which I
43:31
provide about kind of half we're kind of
43:33
50/50 advertisements and reader support,
43:36
but it's that reliable reader support
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that really helps us keep doing these
43:41
podcasts and keep running the site. So,
43:44
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43:45
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it has been for a little while and
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for things like this to trend downward
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over time, but if you can support us
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Watch podcast pre-show in which we talk
44:18
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44:20
You never know what's going to happen.
44:23
It's a surprise.
44:24
I yes, sometimes yes, there's sometimes
44:27
we actually talk about the weather.
44:29
If you support us at $5 a month you get
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44:36
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44:40
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44:42
If you can't support us financially, I
44:44
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44:46
trying times. But you do support us by
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And if you happen to be interested in
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45:58
If you if you go there and buy any
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be sure to send them to podcast.
46:11
[email protected].
46:14
Man, I'm having trouble reading my own
46:16
notes today. Specify the show in the
46:18
subject line and any special
46:19
pronunciation of your name. You can also
46:22
contact us on Discord and if you are one
46:24
of our Patreon subscribers, you can do
46:26
so through the Patreon Q&A podcast
46:28
question channels, our way of saying
46:30
thanks for your support. So, thank you
46:32
everyone for tuning in and uh I'm glad
46:36
you're here. Thanks so much. Thank you,
46:38
Liz. Uh
46:39
I don't know. Joe, did Did we talk about
46:42
um Day of the Dead last time? You mean
46:45
Dead as Disco? We talked about it in the
46:46
post show.
46:47
Okay, then we should talk about it now
46:49
then cuz I don't want to forget again.
46:51
So,
46:53
please do talk about it cuz you talked
46:54
about it last time. It's It's your
46:56
thing. Uh yeah, so we we often talk
46:58
about other games that we're interested
47:00
in or things that have come up across
47:01
our like highlights or something that we
47:03
may have found randomly.
47:05
And one thing that I like as much as
47:08
like MMOs and ARPGs uh and roguelikes,
47:12
is I like rhythm games. I I really
47:15
really like rhythm game. Uh Rift of the
47:17
NecroDancer, Crypt of the NecroDancer,
47:20
uh Cadence of Hyrule, like stuff like
47:22
that is is really keen for me. Uh It's a
47:24
good thing you said Cadence of Hyrule
47:26
cuz at a certain point it might just be
47:28
that you like NecroDancer. It's true.
47:30
But I like other rhythm games like this
47:32
too. Like this has been This has been
47:33
around since for for a while, like since
47:35
AudioSurf. Um
47:37
a new one came across my feed recently
47:40
and if obviously served to me as part of
47:43
like YouTube recommendation, and I
47:45
clicked on it. It's called Dead as
47:46
Disco. And it answers the question,
47:49
"What if you could beat everybody up
47:52
like you were playing Batman: Arkham
47:54
Asylum or any of the Arkham games,
47:55
really,
47:57
uh but do it to the beat of whatever
47:59
song. Well, now you can answer that
48:02
question by playing the game Dead as
48:04
Disco, which is currently in early
48:06
access. The story is loose, as you would
48:08
expect. It's basically a beat-'em-up.
48:11
And, in the initial demo that was
48:14
available for it like a year ago, it was
48:16
really rough. They ironed out all a lot
48:18
of the issues and got basically the
48:22
first set of content available for it.
48:24
And, it's I think it's really neat. And,
48:26
it's like it rewards you for doing
48:28
things to
48:30
the beat. You do extra damage. You get
48:32
cool combo stuff happening. It's very
48:35
fluid.
48:36
And, then if you miss, you still do the
48:38
damage. You just don't do as much
48:40
damage. Really cool, very nice visuals.
48:44
And, it already has an active modding
48:46
community, which is absolutely
48:47
hysterical. Because, two things you can
48:49
do with it is, one, make your own skins
48:51
for the main character, which leads to
48:53
some very interesting, very famous
48:55
people having skins put into the game.
48:58
And, the other thing is you can upload
48:59
your own tracks to it, as well. So,
49:01
like, if you want to beat somebody up to
49:04
Billie Jean, you can. It's great. You
49:07
can go ahead and do it.
49:08
I've been having a lot of fun in early
49:10
access. So, if you like rhythm games and
49:13
you like the idea of a beat-'em-up in
49:14
the style of Batman Arkham ask games.
49:19
Give it a Give it a try. The demo There
49:22
is a demo available on most platforms.
49:25
And, then if you like it, there's early
49:26
access, which obviously you're not
49:28
required to. We're not sponsored or
49:29
anything like that. It's just something
49:31
I enjoy and wanted to throw out there
49:32
because I know I've talked with a lot of
49:34
our listeners about rhythm games in the
49:36
past. And, just wanted to take a moment
49:38
to highlight. Thank you.
49:39
Anyone else have anything else to say
49:40
about it before we move on? No? Okay.
49:43
Subnautica 2 is in early access and it
49:45
sold 2 million copies in 12 hours. I
49:47
don't see much else to say.
49:49
Um, this is very much what everyone
49:52
expected The game was going to do
49:53
gangbusters Yeah.
49:55
from jump and it
49:58
>> [laughter]
49:59
>> The people that tried to stop them from
50:01
getting their big cash payout for
50:03
for making quality games have found out
50:05
what the legal system will do to people
50:07
who take their advice from chat GPT or
50:10
other similar things and
50:12
I'm here for it, you know, let's let's
50:15
name and shame them for like
50:17
Hey, you thought you could ask a robot
50:20
for cohesive legal advice about how to
50:22
get out of paying what you contracted
50:23
for
50:25
and then it turned out that what you did
50:26
was illegal kind of
50:28
kind of bad. And I'm glad that they lost
50:31
their court case and that the people
50:33
that have made Subnautica are supposed
50:35
to get their big payout for doing
50:36
quality work.
50:38
And it's really just nice to see the
50:40
good guys win every once in a while.
50:42
And could you give us the like dime
50:44
store version of what's going on for
50:46
people who have not been following
50:47
Subnautica? Okay, so Subnautica 1 came
50:50
out and everyone loved it. It's a great
50:52
game about building a little sea base
50:54
and exploring a giant ocean and big
50:56
monsters.
50:57
>> It's a survival game. Let's make sure
50:59
that that's also clearly said. Sure.
51:02
Survival game, you build your sea base,
51:03
you go as you
51:05
survive longer, you build more things
51:07
that let you survive deeper and would
51:09
you believe that deeper in the ocean on
51:11
this alien planet there is scarier and
51:13
scarier creatures and eventually you
51:15
escape. And everyone loved it and they
51:17
said, "Wow, we should make another one."
51:19
And the company that they were that was
51:22
producing them said, "Hey, if you guys
51:23
can hit these sales targets, we will
51:25
give you a massive payout like
51:27
life-changing money for all of your
51:29
developers kind of payout." And they
51:31
said, "Of course, we feel confident in
51:33
our ability to create this game and to
51:34
make the money that you've set as our
51:36
as our goal." And then along the way the
51:39
people that real that that promised them
51:41
this payout realized that they were
51:42
going to hit it and that they were on
51:44
the hook for a a of money. And so rather
51:46
than just be like, well, we we
51:48
contracted this, we signed the contract,
51:50
we're we're a producer for a very
51:52
successful video game. They got greedy
51:54
and said, how do we keep our money and
51:57
also release the game? And so, they ask
51:59
the guy in charge asked AI, and AI gave
52:03
him a bunch of bad advice, if you can
52:05
believe it.
52:06
And then, so he basically just fired the
52:08
lead developers, and they delayed the
52:11
launch of Subnautica 2, so that wouldn't
52:14
fall in the original timeline for
52:17
hitting that sales target, and therefore
52:20
target
52:21
activating the bonus. And so, they would
52:23
save a lot of money, they would still
52:24
get their award, possibly award-winning
52:26
at this, you know, everyone loves it so
52:28
far. It's got so many people playing,
52:30
it's got
52:31
2 million copies sold in 12 hours, which
52:33
is going to mean that they are lots of
52:35
people exploring that new alien ocean.
52:37
So, they were going to hit their sales
52:38
target, no problem, and then it turns
52:41
out that yeah, all of the legal things
52:44
did not line up with what ChatGPT or
52:46
whichever AI thing said that they would,
52:49
and the courts all sided in favor of the
52:51
original Subnautica developer. And
52:54
yeah, yeah, here we are. We have the
52:55
game in early access, and uh yeah.
52:57
>> And it's doing gangbusters. Not only did
52:59
it sell
52:59
>> doing gangbusters. Not only did it sell
53:01
2 million copies in 12 hours, but its
53:03
peak concurrent player as of the time of
53:06
this recording,
53:07
uh across all platforms, Steam, Epic
53:09
Games Store,
53:11
Xbox Series X and S,
53:13
uh was 651,000
53:16
players. Uh with Steam accounting for
53:18
half a million of that, roughly. Uh so,
53:21
yeah, people really like the game, and
53:24
it is not much of a surprise. Uh and it
53:27
does add to stuff from the previous one,
53:29
which as you would expect, even in the
53:31
early access, it's doing things like uh
53:33
genetic mutation, where you custom
53:36
tailor your genetic build in order to
53:38
suit your new environment, uh which is
53:41
one of the
53:41
the immediate standout things that I
53:44
noticed when when
53:46
looking into this a couple days ago. So,
53:49
really cool. I'm looking forward to the
53:51
continued success of Subnautica 2.
53:55
So, yeah.
53:56
Cheers.
53:57
>> And I wish nothing but the best for the
53:58
developers on Subnautica. Yeah, Unknown
54:00
Unknown Worlds,
54:01
go for it, man. Like, get it get it.
54:04
I love I've never really engaged with
54:06
Subnautica content on any of my on my
54:08
Instagram, but I've also just been
54:10
served a couple like targeted posts and
54:13
stuff. Yeah, well,
54:15
good.
54:15
>> I organically I saw they've got this
54:17
great little Star Wars reference in it
54:20
to Luke in the Wampa cave back in Empire
54:22
Strikes Back.
54:23
And it's it's so it's so nice to see
54:25
like developers having fun with their
54:27
game and creating something that people
54:29
who realize what they're looking at
54:31
could be like, "Oh, yeah, that's 100%
54:33
that." And if you don't get the
54:34
reference, you don't you miss it. And
54:36
there's nothing lost. One of the one of
54:38
the guys I work with and do magic with
54:40
at the shop is super into like these
54:42
type of games.
54:44
Uh, and one of the things that he
54:46
absolutely adores is he adores No Man's
54:49
Sky.
54:50
And it's very much the same thing. Now,
54:52
we talk about it being sandboxy
54:53
survival, all that stuff. Uh, he saw
54:55
this and lost his bloody mind.
54:59
Immediately called both of his sons and
55:03
this is now like their their weekly
55:05
gaming night thing, which I think is
55:08
just it's that's just it's Also, shout
55:10
out No Man's Sky for like most improved
55:12
ever. Yeah. Yeah, you're never going to
55:15
hear an argument from me.
55:18
But, I'm going to try and get this
55:20
next bit out before we have to close up.
55:23
Uh, this June 5th is going to be Day of
55:25
the Devs as part of the uh,
55:28
Summer Game Fest. But, Day of the Devs
55:30
is the part I always watch really
55:31
carefully because that's where we get to
55:33
like actually,
55:34
you know, see new upcoming indie stuff.
55:37
Um, so I want to mention that. Although
55:39
we don't currently know what they're
55:41
going to be doing,
55:42
but go ahead and list. But also Summer
55:45
Games Fest is
55:46
the it's the big thing with all the
55:48
trailers and all the what's it's. It's a
55:52
Steam deal so it's pretty big. Yeah,
55:54
yeah. So that's going to it's one of the
55:57
biggest gaming events of the year. But
56:00
yeah, there what I think is interesting
56:02
is that there were a ton of other
56:03
showcases during Summer Game Fest. And
56:06
exactly as you said, I think Day of the
56:09
Devs is one of the best ones every year
56:12
because it's not just trailers. It's
56:14
like Devs talking about their games and
56:16
you can always see that these are people
56:18
with real passion and real interest and
56:20
real drive. And I find that a lot more
56:22
interesting than just watching all the
56:24
trailers at Summer Game Fest. So yeah,
56:27
lots lots going on. The big event itself
56:31
is on June 5th. Which is actually that
56:34
one's that that date is sneaking up on
56:36
us. It doesn't feel like we've entered
56:39
it yet. It's charging at us with an axe
56:40
going it's almost here. But yeah. It's
56:43
almost summer.
56:45
Even though the weather is pretty
56:46
summery right now. Regardless, but
56:49
yeah, so
56:50
Friday June 5th Summer Game Fest and
56:53
just a ton of other showcases around it.
56:55
Women led game showcase. That was really
56:57
good last year.
56:59
Wholesome direct which is as the game
57:01
implies
57:02
the most wholesome games that you're
57:04
going to find.
57:06
PC Gaming Show is also really good every
57:08
year.
57:10
But yeah, and a lot of like regional
57:13
gaming showcases. There's the Southeast
57:16
Asian Game Showcase which is really
57:18
interesting everyone every every time it
57:21
comes up. I don't see on the on the list
57:24
in front of me that I found I don't see
57:26
the Latin American game showcase, but
57:28
that
57:29
I like all of these showcases, but every
57:32
year the Latin American Game Showcase is
57:34
astounding.
57:35
I I can't explain it, but it's always
57:38
it's always great.
57:40
Um
57:41
So, I I hope that one's coming back this
57:43
year, too. But, we will we will see. Uh
57:47
but, yeah, this is where this is where
57:48
all your gaming news for the rest of the
57:49
year is going to come out and uh
57:51
hopefully excitement. That's what That's
57:54
what I'm going for.
57:56
Yeah, I mean, the the fact that there's
57:57
going to be not just game announcements,
57:59
but at least with the indie games uh
58:02
stuff, you'll actually get to hear of
58:03
people talk about what they're doing and
58:05
how they did it and why they did it.
58:07
That's always pretty cool. Um I'm not as
58:09
excited for the big Xbox Showcase, quite
58:12
frankly.
58:13
Uh I like Xbox. I play with an Xbox,
58:15
but, you know, I know what Microsoft is
58:18
doing. Microsoft is It's like living
58:20
next to a sauropod. You know what it's
58:23
doing cuz it's stomping on everything. I
58:25
I I can hear it as it crumbles crumbles
58:28
people's dreams. I mean, I don't I don't
58:30
need to
58:31
I don't need to you know, catch up on it
58:33
with the way I I do for like other
58:35
stuff. Like, I wouldn't even have known
58:37
about Pyre if not for indie game news.
58:40
Um Oh, yeah. You know,
58:42
it's just It's one of my favorite games.
58:44
Um but, yeah.
58:45
>> I feel like we talk about this a lot,
58:47
but it's the indie space that is doing
58:49
the interesting stuff here. Whereas, big
58:52
major game
58:53
Yeah, exactly. The big major game
58:55
developers don't want to take risks.
58:56
They want to go out and make games that
58:58
they know are going to be big
59:00
blockbuster games because they've made
59:01
games like this in the past that have
59:03
been big blast blockbuster games. So,
59:06
it's almost like you can't do anything
59:08
that you haven't done before or that
59:10
someone hasn't done before and has been
59:12
a success. So, it feels like the big
59:14
guys take fewer risks. And that means
59:18
>> about like someone tell Warner Brothers
59:20
requiring people to like have a pitch
59:22
that would you know, this plus this or
59:25
they wouldn't even let you try. So,
59:26
yeah, that's that's something
59:28
corporatism does. Mhm.
59:30
All right.
59:31
These are always fun and some of the
59:33
most fun is all of the little side
59:35
showcases. Yeah, I like indie.
59:38
>> Yep. But I think at this point I think
59:40
we're kind of
59:41
out of time. Like, you know, yeah, there
59:43
it is. We're we're right on time,
59:45
really, but it's it's time to end the
59:46
show.
59:47
Um
59:48
>> [laughter]
59:49
>> So, I mean, part of me is like thinking,
59:51
could we could we talk more about Diablo
59:52
now? But the other part of me is like,
59:53
no, don't have to talk more about
59:55
Diablo. Just go
59:56
>> time time is an illusion. You know how
59:58
it is. Just like after you open up
1:00:00
Diablo, time disappears for several
1:00:03
hours.
1:00:04
I I mean
1:00:05
>> just how it works. And so, what you're
1:00:06
saying, Liz, is that time is fleeting?
1:00:09
Yeah, well, I'm more saying time is an
1:00:11
illusion and lunch time doubly so.
1:00:15
My god, the references.
1:00:17
All right, this guys, thank you very
1:00:18
much to Corey for being our special
1:00:20
guest. Thank you to Liz and Joe for
1:00:23
I don't know how you survive doing the
1:00:25
things you do to keep the site going.
1:00:27
Neither do I.
1:00:29
And thanks to all of you for making it
1:00:32
you know, like feasible. Like the only
1:00:34
reason we can even do this is you guys.
1:00:35
So, thank you very much.
1:00:37
Uh this has been the Blizzard Watch
1:00:38
podcast and we'll be back [music] next
1:00:40
week.

Good riddance, Midnight crest caps!

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