Up next in 10
Matt and Joe sit down this week to discuss Vampire: The Masquerade: its lore, some of the source material that inspired it, and how it rippled vampires forward in pop culture. They break down what you need to know about the history of vampires in this setting, which goes back almost to the beginning of humans, so there's kind of a lot to discuss. Clans are the core concept to be aware of, as the demi-families Vampires belong to with certain shared traits. They also have Sects, which are political affiliations, adding to the mess of machinations that make up the Masquerade.
There is ton to discuss, just from the sourcebooks, let alone the novels and video games. So let Matt and Joe get you up to speed before you play Vampire: The Masquerade Bloodlines 2 which comes out this week.
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0:00
[Music]
0:10
Hello and welcome to Lore Watch, round table free form discussion about lore in your favorite media. I'm your host Joe
0:16
Pres, one of several lore focused folks from Blizzard Watch. And I've got my mysterious and dark kindred with me
0:22
today, Matt Rossy. How you doing today, Matt? Finding it hard to remember which button is the one that allows you to hear me
0:28
when I talk. Oh god, which one is it? Oh, it's this one. Yay, I got it.
0:35
Uh, totally fair. Technology, how does it work? Uh, I am totally shadowy and mysterious.
0:41
Which button do I hit? Uh, today friends, we're going to be veering off into a little bit of an off topic. Uh, and this was actually brought
0:47
as a suggestion from one of you, our wonderful listeners. Uh, as always, just a reminder that if there's something you
0:53
want us to cover, whether it's a topic or an off topic, if you have questions or anything you want us to know about,
0:59
go ahead and send those in to podcast at blizzardwatch.com. All we ask is that you specify what show it's for, as well
1:05
as any special pronunciation of your name. Uh, if you are a Patreon subscriber, you can also hit us up on
1:11
Discord. We have two channels set aside. We have the Q and podcast questions channel which is open for everybody but those Patreon subscribers get access to
1:17
the patron Q and podcast questions channel where we tend to look there first as a way of saying thank you for keeping the lights on. Uh
1:24
demand things of us. We want [ __ ] We do. We actually we actually want you to demand things of us. Uh so this one
1:31
is from Denmark from a listener by the name of Jacob. Thank you for listening Jacob. Uh greetings Joe and Matt and the
1:38
rest of the Watchers crew. Uh thanks for the amazing work you're doing every week with the podcast. Well, thank you. Me and my friends played vampire and
1:44
werewolf in the '90s, and we loved the dark world. We got a little sniff into Mage, The Ascension, and Wraith uh
1:50
before other interests kicked in, so I never got an overview of the lore behind these games. Is it possible that you RPG
1:57
and lore experts will do a massive I don't know about massive, but we're going to do our best deep dive into this universe. How did it start, where it is
2:04
now, and what happens in between, and so on, covering everything. I know it might be a big ask, but could be a series. Uh
2:11
we'll see how far we get. So this is rather topical because if you've listened to our other imprint, Tavern
2:17
Watch, uh something that blew my mind was that in the recent version of uh
2:23
Vampire the Masquerade, the latest edition, which is currently sitting on my desk as I'm reading through it, uh changed and updated a lot of the lore of
2:30
the world and turned a lot of stuff on its head. Um so the World of Darkness
2:36
itself was something that was originally created. It was basically um Gothic punk
2:41
is really I guess the best way to put it. Uh so it used something based off the called the storyteller system. It's
2:48
a reflection of our own world. Uh it did take place on Earth, all the same countries, same people in power, you
2:54
know, your Starbucks on every corner, all that stuff is pretty normal. But it was a look into the Gothic side of it,
3:00
the underbelly, the unseen world. Um, and it was in this particular case what
3:06
we call the big three. So, the original big three settings were Vampire the Masquerade, Werewolf the Apocalypse, and
3:13
Mage the Ascension. Uh, Vampire the Masquerade was uh often referred to as a
3:19
game of personal horror um where you play Kindred or Vampires, Children of
3:24
Cain, uh making your way through the power struggles and uh whatever else
3:30
happens to be around you while still being a hunter uh thing because hunters do exist in this world. And in fact, a
3:37
later uh setting with what we'll call the underdogs uh and Apocalyptica, which we'll talk about here in a second, uh
3:43
expanded that world, but it was very much like, well, New York by night, Philly by night, Chicago by night. What
3:49
happens in these dark and and wondrous and horrible places, uh where vampires
3:55
make their their locust of power? Uh then you had Werewolf the Apocalypse
4:00
which was a savage horror game. Uh one of Matt's personal favorites uh where you take on the role of a werewolf going
4:07
through essentially your own call it war of extinction uh as you you
4:14
fight against corruption that is uh essentially taking back you and your kind away from the natural order of the
4:21
world because werewolves are not a curse. They are a naturally occurring thing. And it covered quite the the
4:27
gamut of uh at least at the time like ecological horror, uh personal horror,
4:33
body horror, uh and that struggle. Outsider horror and outsider horror. Yes. Because you like uh very Cthulhuesque essences of
4:41
like the the corrupting forces, I guess, would be the best way to put it. You could Yeah, Cthulu is one example.
4:46
Um, I would actually say that there's a certain amount of, for lack of it a word, industrial horror, too, in that
4:55
kind of like nowadays we say stuff like late stage capitalism, but this was one of the first games to really say this
5:00
this is not sustainable, guys. You know, we we are on the treadmill to
5:06
destruction here. And there were other games that that touched on it, but Werewolf was really in your face about
5:12
it. Yeah. And then the other tentpost uh game that the world of darkness revolved around was Mage the Ascension. Um
5:20
which I got to say before we get into it, one of the most fun experiences I've ever had in my life was playing this
5:26
game. Yeah. And and yeah, I was going to say part of the reason probably is because it's a game that shifts reality, right? Like so the way
5:33
that Mage works as well, Vampire is rooted in the dark reflection of what our everyday world is. Werewolf is the
5:39
corruption and destruction of the natural order. Mage is very much Doctor Strange and you know the
5:45
multi-dimensions of madness type thing. Reality is subjective and mages have the ability to control reality and force it
5:51
to make make it whatever they want at a cost. And yeah, it is it is forcing it.
5:58
Yeah, keep that in mind. And it doesn't like to be forced.
6:03
And that's a really the big balance of that game is you can do what you want,
6:09
but there are consequences. Now, you're like you're like a god. You
6:14
you know, seriously, you are like a god. You you can make reality do what you want it to do, but you're going to pay
6:21
for it one way or another. Yep. Now, there were two I want to one thing before you go. One
6:27
of the things that was really interesting about the original three World of Darkness books and stuff that
6:33
came later kind of kept that going, but we we're talking about these three. I think this is a good a good line in the sand for us because otherwise we will be
6:40
here for years. But I do want to cover the other ones at least bring them up because they are relevant. Yeah. But in terms of the first three,
6:46
what they do is present you with completely different worldviews of the same world for the same place.
6:52
Yeah. Yeah. And that's something to keep in mind as we as we go into this. What the
6:58
vampires tell you happened versus what the werewolves tell you what happened versus what the mages tell you what
7:04
happened are often not just different but completely contradictory. And yet,
7:10
as far as we can tell, they are correct. Yeah. Yeah. And that's something to keep in
7:15
mind as we go into this is there will be times we will tell you this is this is what happened and then we'll later be like this is what happened and those two
7:21
things don't sound like they're even in the same universe. But they are. Now, when these games released, there was
7:26
actually two more that were released alongside of them because originally it was supposed to be a fivepronged uh
7:32
essentially I don't want to call it a table, but like it fit with the theming of the dark
7:37
world and the pentacle and all that other stuff where you have five points. They were Yeah. Wings. Points. Wings.
7:42
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, so you had you had what are called well they're called nowadays the underdogs, but they were originally
7:48
supposed to be a major player with the other ones. Wraith the Oblivion and Changing the Dreaming. Wraith the
7:53
Oblivion is uh a game of well, you play as a ghost. You are a ghost with unfinished business. Uh, and it's all
8:01
about emotion and horror and dealing with mortality in a very real way. Um,
8:07
and then Changeling the Dreaming is very much what you would expect from it. It's a uh modern fantasy. It is you play as a
8:14
changeling. You are the last remnants of the fa realm essentially moving through
8:20
this world. And so it is this this idea of the old world and the new world at
8:26
odds with each other and how you fit in with it. Um yeah, Changing could be seen as in a
8:31
weird sort of way, Wraith and Changing are almost reflections of each other. They kind of are because Wraith is a is a story about
8:38
inevitability, about essentially the continuous decay that life creates. You
8:45
know, not only are you going to die, everything around you is going to die or
8:50
has already died. And that's like, you know, what's the old saying about, you know, everyone
8:56
who's ever lived has died. Yep. Everything that has ever lived has died. in in the world of Wraith going if you
9:02
go to the right place at the right time the trauma from like great extinctions is still a thing. Um whereas in changing
9:12
it's about I I don't want to say it's not necessarily about life itself so much as the thing that makes life life
9:19
and not death. Like what is the difference? What is a life? What is a live thing? What makes
9:25
you a being? What makes you a thing that makes the world because you are in changeling? You are a
9:31
half fay, half human, right? You that's what a changeling is. And you are
9:36
struggling with the the sense of self. What what is it like? What does it mean to be a human? What does it mean to be a
9:42
faye? Um it's an it's a very interesting. What does it mean to dream? What does it mean to dream? Yeah.
9:48
Yeah. Because it's changing was it was changing the dreaming, right? It was changing the dreaming. That is correct.
9:53
Yeah. because that's how that's how you got to Arcadia, which we we'll talk about at some point, I'm sure.
9:59
Um, but then I just want to touch on the last three before we go into some deeper dives. Uh, and this is sort of the three
10:05
settings that heralded what were called the apocalyptica or the end time. Uh,
10:10
basically the everything coming apart at the seams. And there were three. There was Orpheus, which was uh probably the
10:18
least popular of all the games. It's a game of ghost stories for ghosts is the best way to put it. the the don't look
10:24
back. Um, but it was basically an apocalypse for wandering spirits with
10:29
unfinished business. And so it was finishing that story out. Then you had Demon the Fallen, which was basically
10:37
what you you think on the tin. Uh, players assume the role of the fallen angels who have been consigned to the
10:43
abyss uh for loving humanity too much. uh and you are struggling with the idea
10:49
of reconciling, never going home, but at the same point watching the world that you love that you gave up everything for
10:56
coming apart at the seams. Uh and then your role therein like whether you are to bring destruction to it and destroy
11:02
everything like one of the motivations was to destroy the world to get back to heaven or whether you wage war on God.
11:09
Um, and then the last one, which is probably the the four like one of the more popular games in the series and
11:15
actually has a fifth edition uh re renaissance recently is Hunter the
11:20
Reckoning where humans have finally figured out all this stuff is going on. And yep, so imbued with abilities either
11:28
from their uh their faith or from magic or from uh stolen power, uh they're
11:36
going to war. And whether this war is taking out vampires, taking out werewolves, banishing demons, banishing
11:43
ghosts, fighting against mages, or making them work for them, uh because
11:48
they realize what they can do and putting them on a tight leash with shot collars, humans are fighting back. And
11:54
it was called the year of reckoning. And it was probably one of the most
12:00
aside from Werewolf and Vampire, I would say that it was probably more popular
12:06
than Mage the Ascension here, at least for me in the '9s. Now, all I really do think to a certain degree,
12:12
uh, I have to agree, even though I prefer Mage and I think Mage had more of an impact on the setting, I cannot argue
12:20
with the sheer number of people I saw playing this game. Yeah. like just just a lot of people wanted to play this one and for reasons
12:27
I understood uh nobody there there's a certain amount of for one thing you know Buffy the Vampire Slayer existed
12:34
it was huge during this time frame yeah yeah we we cannot pretend it wasn't there um there's a lot of stuff a lot of
12:41
media that is very definitely influenced by these books just as much as there's
12:46
media that influenced them uh so in a weird sort of way yeah Hunter
12:52
Hunter ended up being much big. It was it it punched way above its own weight
12:58
class, which is kind of acceptable when you look at what you're talking about in it. You know, that is what it is. It's
13:04
about punching way above your weight class. And one of the things I want to note about this is how ambitious this whole
13:09
world building was. um when you you're you're essentially coming into this with
13:14
like I said with this Gothic punk this storyteller system when it started making the rounds the only other large
13:21
competition game was Dungeons and Dragons and we had just moved at least
13:27
in my area the popularity of it shifted because it was moving from second
13:32
edition to third edition and 3.5 uh which were wildly popular at the time
13:38
and this moving in parallel aside from And while there were a ton of worlds and ton of universes that you could explore
13:45
in Dn D at the time, they weren't all linked. So Greyhawk and and Forgotten
13:50
Realms were not a portal away from each other at the time. Uh they were not dealing with things like uh the
13:57
essentially the blind eternities and moving between the realms. Uh it was very much one and done. You you were in
14:03
a end of it or you you know were in Spell Jammer but it wasn't able to go to
14:08
the other places. because it wasn't built for that. Here, everything was interlocking.
14:14
Everything had elements of it everywhere else. If you read one of the Vampire the
14:19
Masquerade books, it tied in with stuff that was happening in the werewolf and the mage stories as well as the Hunter
14:26
the Reckoning stuff because all of it was inter interwoven. All of it affected
14:31
each other and it was very ambitious. Yeah, very much so. And to the point
14:36
where when you first saw vampire, you may not have any interest in the other
14:41
two, but there's a clan of vampires who used to be mages
14:47
and who became vampires because they were like, "We don't ever want to die." Mhm.
14:52
So, we're going to find a vampire and we're going to do stuff and we're going to become vampires and we're going to then use our mage knowledge as you. And
14:59
they didn't realize, oh no, we can't do magic the way we used to anymore. we've lost that connection, but we can
15:06
now we can study this this strange thing that makes us vampires. Uh, and so that that actually tied into it was the first
15:13
little hint of what mages were all about. And meanwhile, there are werewolves all over that book even
15:19
though they don't they're not friendly. Like you the vampires are aware of the
15:24
werewolves. They call them lupines and they try to avoid them. There's no point to going out there and
15:30
fighting them because they'll kill us. and instis what we can get. We're we're probably gonna wind up talking to the
15:35
vast majority about probably vampire because I think it's the largest of the of all of the imprints and probably
15:40
where it has the most overlap. Um but like there were being divided by
15:46
clans. Some clans dealt with the werewolves better. Uh yeah, like the gangrell. Yeah.
15:51
Yeah. Gang girl could basically be like, "Look, uh, I know you hate me, but I am
15:57
the least of your problems with the vampires, and I just want to go through and and go somewhere else. How would you
16:03
just let me pass through?" And they'd be like, "He's got a point. I mean, yeah, we could kill him, but he's, you know,
16:09
he's been around for a thousand years. It's going to take forever, and we've got lots of other stuff to fight." Yeah,
16:14
that makes sense. Uh, we're going to let you pass through, but I'm telling you right now, if you've got any like blood
16:20
sucker friends that you would like us to know about, oh yeah, sure, you can know about these ones. I hate those guys.
16:26
Sure. And it was it was very much the setting was ready for expansion just
16:34
by its very nature. And I say this as somebody I got the book back when it was obviously made on a Macintosh Performer
16:41
2. Yep. I'm not kidding when I say this. It was not just obvious. I had the same program
16:49
that they obviously used uh Cork Express. They clearly used Cork Express
16:55
to make this game. Um that's how far back it goes. Uh and I I we're talking
17:01
about the games and not the, you know, re not how what happened in reality. But I do have to point out that it's even
17:07
deeper than that because there was an entire other game called Ars Magika that
17:13
was technically owned by a different company that was essentially the the grandpa of all this because the same guy
17:20
Mark Reinhagen was involved in both and that's where the storyteller system was created. Yeah. So it's even wilder in terms of
17:28
how we got this. But yeah, so you want to talk about vampire first. So where do you think we should start? Yeah. I think No, I think we're going to
17:35
start with the Well, we can start with Cain. So, the the essential root of all
17:41
vampires is that they are Canaanites. They are children of Cain. Cain and
17:46
Abel. Like we're we're talking about those Can that Cain. Um unless you're from Asia, but we'll get
17:51
into that. That that's a whole other other stuff. Um but essentially Kane for his hubris
17:59
and murdering his brother uh is essentially the first vampire and all
18:05
other vampires in this world are descendant from him. And this is
18:10
actually not unique to this story. There is actual real world mythology in which
18:16
Kane is referred to as the first vampire. Uh like I I forgot what
18:21
cultures it really is like a root in. But like yeah like that was his punishment from
18:27
God for killing his brother was that he will live forever eternal with his rage and monster inside of him.
18:34
In some in some versions it's not even seen as a punishment. Uh it's seen as
18:41
but because Kane committed the first murder he is not allowed to be murdered.
18:47
that that's he doesn't get to to die and rest, but it's it's also a mark that
18:53
keeps other people from doing the same thing to him because he's not, you know, partially
18:58
because he's again not allowed to be free, but also partially because Cain was, you know, Cain was like one of the
19:05
first humans, you know, one of the very first people supposedly one of the children of of of
19:12
Adam and Eve, right? Yeah. So the idea of allowing him to be murdered by his own family would make it
19:20
worse. It's like he's already killed his own brother and now if you now kill him
19:26
it's even more you know fractur side and and of course then there's the Lilith stuff which comes in as well
19:33
which we can we can talk about. I mean maybe a like go ahead if you want to like just bring that up. No, no, that's just it's it's in one of the great
19:40
things about uh vampire is at some point they decided they were gonna just lay it
19:45
all out all this stuff that the vampires believe is true and they put out the
19:50
book of nod which is very it's fun. It's one of those things I love about some
19:56
role playing game products. I literally have it up on my on my other screen right now. Yeah, they deliberately put out uh like
20:04
supplemental material that is not in any way really it's not a game product.
20:09
No, but it's lore. It's just story. It's just a big big book of lore. And
20:15
that's one of the things I love it. In the book of Nod, Lilith is a is a kind of I don't want to say major character, but
20:21
she is definitely in what's going on. Yeah. And and I want to point that out too like that was also unheard of at the
20:27
time. So this game at '92 93 and I think the revised edition was 98 um was unique
20:33
among tabletop role playing games despite the there was a ton of them maybe not as many as there are now but
20:40
like when you bought a book or you produced the book most game companies were so small even Wizards at the time
20:47
that it was very rare for them to release anything that wasn't a game book or something that was mechanical but
20:54
here you have the world of darkness fleshing out their world by releasing completely optional supplemental books
20:59
at reasonable price points to just tell stories. And in these books, we learn things like how vampire society is set
21:06
up um such as being descendants of Cain, but then there is further division after
21:11
that. In the modern world, we break down into uh there is essentially two layers
21:18
to every uh relationship and vampire. There are sex and there are clans. And I
21:23
mean sex s ect cct t-s um where there are three main sex that
21:30
you a vampire could potentially belong to. The camarilla which is I'm I'm going to air quote here presented as the good
21:38
guys in the book. Uh very bureaucratic. They certainly present themselves that. They absolutely they present themselves
21:43
that as that. Yes. They have very much a power structure in place. They're very political. um they
21:49
are very much in charge of cities of power uh which we'll cover in a second. Uh there's the Sabat which is
21:55
essentially the shadow of the Camarilla and then comprised of essentially the clans that were rejected or refuse to
22:02
join the Camarilla uh usually dealing with darkness or uh you know things that
22:08
are are considered anthemma to civilized culture and I I'll air quote that as well. and then anarchs that just want to
22:14
burn it all down because they don't believe that the Camarilla or the Zabat are good for anything. Um, and it is
22:20
possible that many of the clans could exist in any of them. Um, which we'll talk about the clans here in a second,
22:27
but it was always interesting because that was always the power struggle, these these three essentially again tent
22:35
poles, these three sects that dictated everything. So yeah, either you believed you followed
22:41
the Camarilla because you wanted something that reminded you of what it was like to be a living human. Um that
22:48
you they kind of like created a sort of for lack of a better word like a a a shadow world where you could deny the
22:56
beast inside you and try to cling to your humanity. Um the Sabbath were like
23:01
that's stupid. We're not human. The idea
23:07
that you can just hold on to your humanity is ridiculous. It's like saying you know a tree cannot hold on to being
23:13
a ukarote uh you know this is madness. Uh so their basic rebellion was on all
23:20
the structures that the Camarilla had been trying to preserve even before the Camela existed because Cheml is very
23:26
much a reflection of the shadow society that existed before
23:31
uh the Sabbath rebellion which was you know ultimately created the Sabbath
23:38
which was a rejection of that attempt to maintain one's humanity. uh and the two
23:44
clans that led that which we will talk about very much instrumental in that mentality. The anarchs were essentially
23:51
the reaction to the reaction. And again we when we say gothic punk this is the punk part of the gothic
23:57
punk. Yeah. The anarchs are very much you know the '90s punk scene battle vest burning
24:03
things down. You're ridiculous because you're trying to pretend to be human which we're not. You're ridiculous because you're trying
24:09
to forget being human which we were. You cannot be a vampire without having been
24:14
a human. So, you're both stupid and we're going to just burn it all down
24:20
because you're like bloated ticks and, you know, creeping rot uh that that's
24:26
making society worse and we hate our own existence and we hate you even more for
24:32
making it. So, yeah, it's very much it is very punk. The the anarchs are their
24:38
own in a lot of ways. I love the anarchs most of all the vampire stuff. They're they know they're doomed and they're
24:44
going to do it anyway. Uh just just a lot of fun there in that in that whole story. So, I'm going to go through the list of
24:51
clans real quick and I'm going to use the modern names for them. Uh simply because while this game took place in
24:57
the '9s and while it was definitely ahead of its time, it definitely had some problems with it. Um,
25:03
yeah. I mean, it was the brainchild of a of a few people at first and then it expanded out and some pe new
25:09
people would come in and be like, "Hey, uh, by the way, that's that's not great." Yeah. So, we're we're talking about terms that were very insensitive um that
25:18
we now know are, you know, or consider slurs. Um, we're used to name certain things and has in recent editions they
25:25
have corrected this, which good on them. Um so you have the clan uh Banu Hakeim
25:32
uh which are uh silent masters of assassination. Um they are uh arbiters
25:38
of also justice. Uh they are very familiar with as far as like blood in
25:44
blood rituals. Uh and they believe in being closer to the progenitor and closer to what is essentially I wouldn't
25:50
say lawful good but lawful. Um you have clan bruha which were philosopher kings
25:56
of ancient civilizations. uh but are now mostly your rebels and rogues uh which
26:02
tend to be in fury. They tend to be a lot more in the punk category. Um they are very disruptive and loud and uh not
26:09
necessarily as loud as some of their their compatriots, but they're definitely there. Uh clan gangrell,
26:16
which are the more beastial in nature. We referred to them earlier. Um they often take on anim animalistic traits as
26:22
they uh get a little more older. uh Clan Hecata, which has replaced both uh Clan
26:29
Capidoshian and Clan Giovani, which were essentially the same clan, just divided between uh the Camarill and the Sabat.
26:37
Um they're essentially a family of vampires who propagate their own family through a long lineage. They are also
26:44
known as the necromancers, um where they deal a lot with death and death magic and ancestor worship and
26:51
things like that. um Clan Lassombra, which are uh basically the unofficial leaders of the
26:58
Sabat or at least were. Um they command the very essence of darkness and shadow
27:05
uh to the point of actually worshiping it. Um and
27:10
bear aspects of that. uh clan Malcavian, a fractured uh a clan fractured by
27:16
madness uh where each member is uh has some form of mental malady um even if
27:22
they didn't when they were human being turned and brought into that bloodline brings with it a degeneration in the
27:28
blood and therefore some mental breakdown. uh the clan ministry which
27:34
was formerly known as the followers a set uh which is an evangelical religious movement uh based off of a cathonic god.
27:42
Uh so you know you can kind of see where that's going with that. Um they they are all about secrets and secret brokering
27:48
and ancient artifacts gathering clan Naseratu which would be something that you're probably familiar with if you've
27:54
seen the movie Naseratu. Um, yep. These are vampires that have a physical disfiguration with them and are often
28:01
shunned uh by the rest of vampire society, no matter what sect they belong to. Um, clanodor,
28:09
they are, if you think of French aristocratic or noble vampire, that's what they are. Uh,
28:17
they're all about sensual pleasure and uh, idolizing physical beauty and adoration uh, over everything else. I
28:24
would argue that they're also about sensuality in all its forms. Yep. Not just sexual, not just pleasurable.
28:32
Yeah. Um they are patrons of art. They are very much expected to be talented
28:39
artists. And if they are not, they are expected to make sure that talented artists are allowed to do that
28:46
their thing. But it's it's a double-edged sword. You don't necessarily want one of these guys as your patron.
28:52
Yeah. because they will also think they think about you as as something to
28:58
consume. Yeah. Um yeah, there's also clan Ravvenos uh which were nomads. Um their name is
29:05
different. The cousins Yeah. Cousins of the Gangrell. Cousins of the Gangrell. These these are the Romany essentially.
29:12
Um they had a different name prior and obviously that has been changed. Um, but
29:18
they are their one uh trick or their one flaw cuz all these are flawed in some
29:24
way is that they have a propensity for vice no matter what that vice is. Um,
29:29
but they tend to be nomads and tricksters. Um, and they can masters of
29:34
almost like illusion magic if that were the case. Yeah, it's kind of like two different ways to look at them and the gangrell
29:41
are really interesting in that's two different ways to look at the concept of nomaticism
29:47
among vampires. Uh, in a lot of ways what the Gangrell managed to accomplish
29:53
through their, you know, allowing themselves to become more and more feral, the Ravnos create a society
30:01
of their own that rejects all other societies. um that if you are one of if you are one
30:08
of the Ravvenos or in some cases a gangrell you get treated like a person
30:15
but nobody else you don't protect anybody else that way. It's all about the family and because the gang and the
30:21
ravenous are so closely related they often give each other more of a birth than they would give anybody else.
30:27
Yeah. Uh there's three more clans here that I want to get through real quick uh
30:32
because we'll be here all day if otherwise. Uh you have clan tremir which are vampiric sorcerers. Uh very much in
30:39
line with that whole if you were a mage in life and you die you're probably going to wind up in clan trem. It's
30:44
generally going to be the natural inclination. If they can get you Yeah. If they can get you they will. Yep. Uh and they're they tend to have uh
30:51
supernatural powers. Uh whether it is from their past or born of the blood. Uh
30:57
you have Clan Zamise which is um Eldrich oldworld horror in human in humanlike
31:03
form. Um, if HR Guyer was a vampire, let's put it that way. They're all about flesh and bone
31:09
manipulation. Uh, so if you see like if you ever watched uh the Castlevania
31:16
anime or played a Castlevania game and you have those Gollums made of flesh and bone or those weird amalgamations of
31:22
humanity uh or what they call I think they were like the nightstalkers or whatever they are that they create with the forges. That's clans and me. Like
31:30
that's what they do. Also, there's a subclan that they've that's part of them that called the the Gargoyles.
31:36
Yes. And they're essentially vampire heavies, for lack of a better word. The they're
31:42
they are bound to this me. They sometimes break free, but there are many
31:47
of them that are completely bound and loyal and they just serve as muscle for
31:52
the smeise that and also very much not somebody you want to fight one-on-one.
32:00
very very hard. Let's put it that way. And then the last and certainly not
32:06
least is the clan Ventrew, which are sensibly the nobles. They're the kings
32:12
of the the the Camarilla. They are the noble nobility of vampire society. Um they're their vice is greed. Uh often
32:20
seeking more of of whatever they accumulate, whether like a like a dragon, whether they're accumulating gold or secrets or power or whatever. um
32:28
usually at the expense of others. Um this is your listats if you've ever
32:34
watched Interview with a Vampire. Um that he absolutely would have been Clan Ventrew as far as this goes. They put on
32:41
heirs of uh polite society and civility,
32:46
but are just as likely to uh stab you in the back if it serves them gaining more
32:52
power in some capacity. Now, these clans, the interesting thing about them is one of the reasons that it's
32:59
separated is because each of the clans has like a specialty and they specialize in certain aspects of power, whether
33:04
born through their blood and these are all disciplines or aspects that were
33:10
inherited through Cain essentially. So, Cain being the progenitor had all of these aspects. He was the beast. He was
33:18
the the justicar. He was the necromancer. He was all of these things.
33:24
Uh but as he child or as he sired children um in this case turning folks
33:31
to his family, bringing them in, they inherited different aspects of that blood which became the progenitors of
33:37
entire clans. Um and as they get older, as clans become more as a vampire
33:44
becomes longer lived, they take on further aspects of their heritage, their
33:50
progenitors. Um whether it's worth pointing out that the first three descendants of Cain are considered the
33:57
primordials. Um they're anti powerful anti-olivians. Yeah. Yeah. The they and their their descendants who
34:05
are the ones who actually found the modern clans more or less. Uh we did there's one clan that there's
34:12
a one clan head that we haven't mentioned yet in any way because we his clan no longer exists. Uh except it's
34:19
back now I believe. Which one? The Saul. The Solot.
34:24
They would. Yeah. The Si Solot and his his his descendants. They're the ones who uh be
34:30
were used to help create the Tremir in the first place. And then they're they're back now. They
34:35
they've never really left, but they've been hiding. Well, they were from other vampires. They were pacifists in the in
34:42
everything. And so were almost hunted to extinction, but they are back now. The clan the clan
34:47
has been returned. Um, and the in Go ahead. Going back to Kane, go ahead.
34:54
No, go right ahead. Okay. Uh, as Joe pointed out, uh, as as
34:59
you create vampires, like essentially Kane made three, those three each made
35:04
three more. And that was the foundation of like most of the clans that we now have were from those nine. Ultimately,
35:12
those nine, they're also considered anti-olivians. They they were the most powerful
35:19
known vampires. Like the the ones that made them were essentially like so powerful and so old that they were gone.
35:26
Nobody knew where they were or what they were doing. And that comes back later because we
35:32
talked about the fact that there's an entire book about the end of all this. Um the the the ones that founded those
35:38
clans or then had clans founded off of what they had done were so powerful that
35:45
they almost practically embodied a form of of power. Like each one of
35:51
them was like the one of this. Um for example, the the Bruha clan was founded
35:58
by a guy named Bruha. Like that was what he called himself. and he was uh what
36:04
his ability was was essentially being able to think faster than anybody around
36:10
him. Uh an ability that eventually became called solarity. That was
36:15
something that he embodied. His clan's interesting in that they think they
36:20
successfully rebelled against him. And there's something we should talk about here because you're going to talk
36:26
about this and to understand a lot of the conflict in vampire society. Um,
36:31
it's called diablarization. Yep. Or diaboly. Essentially, whilst the the
36:38
Sabbath absolutely embraced this, the Camarilla and its predecessors were
36:44
absolutely horrified by it. To uh to to explain it real quick, uh
36:49
also called Amaranth, if uh you are a Sabat, and I just want to throw that out there. Uh, it is the act of drinking
36:55
another Canaanite's blood till death, drawing their soul into your own,
37:00
completely consuming them. And the good and the bad of this is, you
37:05
know, the bad's obvious, like, you know, you you die. Like, if someone does this to you, you die. You're gone. It's it's
37:12
a death from which there is no return. The upside is you become essentially as
37:18
powerful if as that vampire. So if that vampire was stronger than you, if they
37:24
were of an older generation and had more power and more potential for power, you become that. You can essentially go
37:31
from, oh, I'm of the sixth generation, which is still pretty powerful. Sixth
37:37
generation vampires are nobody's no joke to, oh, now I'm of the fifth generation
37:42
because I I completely exanguinated a fifth generation vampire. It doesn't
37:47
just mean you're stronger. It means you have more potential to grow stronger. Yeah.
37:53
And as a result, you can see why elder vampires would not like this
37:59
because that means they ultimately will become food to their own offspring.
38:05
So that's why the entire Camarilla is based around the concept of this being bad. There's also a a a story hook here
38:12
where uh some of the Antolivians and Methuselas, which are Methuselas are just longived vampires, older f like
38:19
earlier generation vampires like second, third, fourth. They're like Yeah, they're still
38:24
powerful, but they're not quite on the power of a second generation or third generation.
38:29
Yeah, they're not anti- Dolovians or or you know, founders, but they're still up there. You don't want to mess with them.
38:34
But a story hook too is that part of the reason why it's so looked upon is that or looked down upon by the the Camarilla
38:42
is that many of the antidolivians and Methuselas are believed to have figured out how to survive their own death by
38:50
essentially forcing their souls into whoever is attempting to diabolize them and taking over their physical body. And
38:59
whether this is true or not, nobody knows. Uh but if you allow
39:06
unfettered diabolarization of all those under you with no penalty, somebody's
39:12
going to figure it out. And then an aspect of power that the antidolivians and have is now subverted because now
39:20
you have folks realizing there is a way beyond the final death. It it is
39:27
fascinating how that is is sort of like worked in both mechanically with the uh
39:33
lowering of your generation, the staining of your aura because you do you get a black smudge on your aura, an oily
39:40
slick to it that others that can see auras uh immediately can tell that you
39:45
have diabolized something as well as losing points of your humanity which is
39:50
again is represented by you essentially. I I guess we should talk about humanity
39:55
a little bit here too. So yeah, the the entire pre premise of Vampire uh the masquerade is this
40:03
continuous tightroppe that one way or another you have to walk. Um, it doesn't
40:10
have to be the way any of the factions do it, but you have to grapple with this
40:15
as you the the whole premise of what you're doing as a vampire to survive is
40:21
harvesting the life out of other people
40:26
and you were a person up until this curse was inflicted on you. The curse of
40:31
Cain is now your curse. You are you are basically marked and you are unable to
40:40
sustain your life without hurting someone even if it's as some vampires manage to
40:47
like stay out of it as much as possible. They get people to give them their blood. They don't hurt anybody. But it's
40:55
always possible because that beast is always inside you. And it's that war
41:00
that is central to this game in terms of what your character is about.
41:06
Yeah, there's there's a lot here. And I I should also point out and again there's a lot here and we're jumping
41:12
around a little bit and I apologize that it's a lot. It it's a lot. And they though likely we'll do more episodes in the future when when
41:18
when time permits. Um but the game also isn't just contained and the story isn't
41:24
just contained to the modern era. So, no, a dark ages right there.
41:29
Not just dark ages, but like the entire gamut from the game itself, while it does have mechanical, it does have games
41:35
that take place in these uh in the ancient times in the the world of dark the dark ages, but also like the Wild
41:42
West and places like that, this is a game that the story spans essentially
41:47
the dawn of humanity forward. And they lean into that a lot. So a lot of the
41:53
traditions that are set up, a lot of the struggles of being human are tied to real world events. Uh there are actual
42:00
references in the original books to like Jesus and Judas. Um there are, you know,
42:07
references to various world religions um and where the kindred were in
42:13
relation to it or whether some of these miraculous figures were kindred in general. Um, it it's it weaves into the
42:22
real world so deeply that it is very easy to just say, "Yeah, I could totally
42:29
see being at a nightclub and that person over there in the corner with that entourage, uh, those eyes definitely
42:35
were actually glowing red. It wasn't just an optical illusion to the point where they actually, one of the things
42:41
that is a real world thing that they actually used. Uh, back in the 90s there were people who seriously went around
42:47
and they probably still do. There's probably still a subculture of it. I'm just no longer in those circles. There
42:52
were people who straight up wandered around drinking each other's blood. Yeah. There were clubs for it. And that gets
42:58
worked in. One of my favorite vampire um collections, for lack of a better word,
43:03
is a book they put out relatively early in the in the run of the game when it started taking off. Basically, famous
43:11
vampires. They they went through like Vanney the vampire um you know the
43:17
vampire from Camarella they went through all these different Carmela sorry but Carmela is a big inspiration on the
43:22
Camarella right down to the name um they went through and said yes some of these
43:27
really were vampires and also other historical figures yes these ones were vampires and one of the historical
43:33
figures is Vlad Tepish they straight up tackle almost no
43:40
vampire fiction up to this point had had the stones to to make Daddy Dracula one of them.
43:49
Mhm. And this game did and they did it in the whole reason Dracula is famous in this
43:55
setting is because he deliberately got so you know uh Brahm Stoker to write the
44:01
book so he'd be so famous that nobody would believe he really existed.
44:06
And I think he what what clan did he belong to? technically this is me but he
44:12
hated them. He did not want to be associated with them. Uh but he was
44:17
technically one of them. Uh and and it was another thing is that by making
44:23
himself so famous they wouldn't hunt him for what he had done like his history as
44:29
a as a warlord was all about him as a human trying to destroy vampires.
44:34
And as a punishment they embraced him. They made him into a vampire. That's what it's called by them, by the way.
44:40
And yeah, it's just one of the It's a tiny little bit. It's mentioned in one place and it never really comes up
44:47
again. But yeah, Dracula exists and is essentially a boogeyman to other
44:54
vampires because of the book that he had them write. He had Bram Stoker, right?
44:59
Just so he could do this, just so he could essentially step out of the war that he had he found himself in. And I
45:05
do think it's funny that uh at least if I remember correctly, he started I think
45:10
he was like a sixth generation and then Diabloized himself into the fifth. And like they even go so far as to codify uh
45:18
Lucy West uh Western and uh and Willina Harker as like actual
45:25
childer that he sired like Yep. Like like they went through the whole thing.
45:30
Yeah. This thing these things happened. He was actually almost killed by a by a
45:36
Texan with a with a blowing knife essentially. Um the whole deal like the
45:42
book is is like based on real events. It's just in it he's gone because he
45:48
didn't want anyone to find him whereas in reality he wasn't gone. Uh, and it's
45:54
it's really just it's a cute I I hate saying cute because it's dim it's dimminionative, but it is really elegant
46:01
in that it it accepts this, it makes it it folds it into its worldview and then
46:07
it moves on. And yeah, that's and I remember like one of my
46:13
favorite games that we played of this game. I I've played all of the World of Darkness uh up until I think I don't
46:19
think I ever played Demon. Um but I played most of it. And one of my
46:24
favorite vampire stories we did my character who looked the youngest cuz I was a bruha. Um I was from Carthage.
46:34
I was literally from the city of Carthage which was the big bruha strong point. And one of the reasons that the
46:41
the Punic Wars happened between Rome and Carthage was that the Bruha and the
46:46
Ventrew were were fighting. And so they decided they're going to have their cities fight. You know, they're going to
46:53
they're going to have proxy wars. And my character was that old. Not particularly
46:58
powerful. I would I think I was like only only like sixth generation, which is considered really powerful in the
47:05
modern day, but at the time that was foot soldier territory. Um, so yeah, it's one of those games
47:11
where you could basically be that old. So it's hard to remember what your humanity even was. Like what was I like
47:19
as a human? It's been for me it's been 2,000 years. I don't remember very well.
47:26
And and there's another aspect of the story that I think actually is highlighted by you bringing up Dracula and this as well is the reason that it's
47:32
called the masquerade. And I think that this is another huge element of the story, right? Uh the central principle
47:39
for the narrative is that your existence needs to be a secret from humanity
47:46
because if humans were to find out then Hunter kicks off. Um, and those that are
47:54
that break that rule that that show their true selves to humanity, uh, and
47:59
don't obuscate it, there are severe consequences which can include, uh,
48:05
what's called torpour, being pushed into a like a, uh, essentially a hibernation state, deprived of blood, starved out,
48:13
and buried for centuries until you pay for your crimes and by by time served
48:19
and are resurrected. Ed uh essentially um and this is something that actually goes
48:24
back to like some of the most powerful vampires who ever existed. There is a place on earth um ironically enough
48:32
underneath Jerusalem that a is considered to be one of the antidolivians is held in torp for his
48:39
crimes and as a result there's a whole bunch of madness and death and murder
48:46
that happens in that area because of him. And that's not, this isn't confirmed. It's an explanation vampires
48:53
have for why none of them want to go there. And so the and and the interesting thing
48:58
is like going back to the Dracula thing, he exposed himself to humans through the
49:04
writing of that book, but it was a bit of power because in order to go after him, they had to admit that he was real
49:10
and not a work of fiction. And that exposes them. So, and it makes it breaks the masquerade
49:16
essentially by making himself a public figure, he has to be fictional. That's the only way to get around this
49:23
is is if you if you admit he's real, you are breaking the masquerade. Now, the
49:29
interesting thing that I will say is that and I'm not going to say vampire myth. I'm going to say specifically the
49:35
world of darkness. how much this setup influenced storytelling in movies and
49:42
video games and comic books for generations, right? So, this was early
49:49
'9s that this started coming out and it was so wildly popular that you can see elements of it in popular media. The
49:57
Blade movie, for example, the very first one um is not very much a Blade comic. It is
50:02
very much a World of Darkness movie just with Blade in it. with Blade in it. Uh the way
50:07
they took the character of Blade from Marvel Comics, who was basically a vampire hunter, and they put it in a
50:13
World of Darkness thing where everybody else was in an obvious vampire clan.
50:18
It was kind of funny, but not just a clan, like a a hierarchy, a structure. Like you look at Frost and and all of that, and it is very much the
50:25
Camarilla. It's very much, it opens with a scene in a club where vampires are feeding and it's very much right from
50:32
the very first book, the very first adventure that you are to run in Vampire
50:37
the Masquerade. Um, Underworld, the the the movie that you know, vampires and
50:43
werewolves, a lot of that stuff really pulls from this, too. Oh, yeah. Big time. Uh, big time to the
50:49
point where they were there was actually lawsuit talk. There was. Right. and they ultimately didn't sue because you know it's very
50:55
hard to claim you own the concept of vampires and werewolves but it was serious if you've ever played any of
51:02
these games you looked at underworld were like oh hey somebody decided they didn't have to get the rights
51:07
including the concept of like the antidolivians and Methuselas living in torpour and being awoken uh after so
51:13
many times and them even dreaming have an effect on the world around them the idea the idea that they could make a
51:18
artificial means to kill vampires that didn't require actual sunlight or
51:24
actual garlic. The the idea of a hybrid between a werewolf and a vampire actually did
51:29
exist in this game before Underworld. Oh yeah, Chicago by Night, man. Chicago by Night. It was one of the one
51:35
of the main story elements of it was I think it was as a me. I can't remember. It's been a long time. Was literally
51:42
messing around with what happens if I do this thing. Yeah, I think it might have been me. I
51:47
don't remember. But I do remember the uh kind of just straight up talk about it. I remember the abomination who is
51:53
basically what happens if you successfully embrace a werewolf you get the abomination which is
52:00
it's not werewolf plus vampire it's werewolf times vampire.
52:06
Uh it it is a multiplicative factor. All the stuff that makes a werewolf what it
52:12
is is completely opposed to all the stuff that makes a vampire what it is.
52:18
So, if you get one to work, it's the worst thing for both of them. And
52:26
yeah, uh it's it's wild. It's a wild story. But yeah, it's very much if you've seen
52:33
Underworld, it it's it is pretty similar to what you see there. Uh the the the
52:40
justification is not the same, but it it feels very similar. Uh, and even like
52:46
other stuff like like Buffy really. Buffy's got Buffy's cribs from this time
52:52
and again. Um, this got its own stuff too, but and I'm sure Jos would never
52:57
admit that he'd heard of it, but nevertheless, uh, it's pretty obvious at times. Um, the character of Spike, I
53:04
think, is very much feels like it was written by somebody who's had a werew a vampire game going on in the background.
53:10
Uh just it's it's very bruha. Um that's
53:16
my opinion, but whatever. But yeah, Joe's absolutely right. It's all over the place. You can you can to the modern
53:22
day it's to the point now where you see a lot of vampire fiction and you wonder
53:28
did did they play vampire as a kid? Like where where did you where did you because this feels it feels very vampire
53:34
the masquerade. Yeah, it really does. And and the reason I bring this up is because one, we're running out of time, but two, like this
53:42
game is not just a niche thing. It was very influential and in fact was as far
53:49
as I'm concerned in the '9s responsible for modernizing the mythology of vampires. like a lot of the core
53:56
elements of the story of tying it in with the roots of Christianity and other world religions. The idea of paraly
54:04
parallel trajectory with real world using real world to inform the myth in a
54:10
lot of ways brought the old vampire myths of you know Dracula forward. Until
54:15
this point, a lot of the things we saw for Dracula were very oldworld, very like out of place as far as the modern
54:23
cons like sensibilities go. Not to say that they were bad representations, but they weren't modernized. They were still
54:30
in the roots of they were actually to a certain degree they were all about a character who is
54:35
out of time. Yeah. Very much so. If you if you look at the the Bella Lugosce version of Dracula, he is very much an oldworld
54:42
nobleman who comes to London and is like he's he is of a different period of
54:48
time. He is of a different era and that's the that's the big subject of it all. Um, I will also say in terms of
54:58
vampires, you know, effect on, you know, vampire media, like if you go back and
55:04
look at like there's there's several books that I think are really important to read to understand how we got here.
55:12
Uh, one of them is The Phantom World. Uh, yep. Yep. Yep. And it is a fascinating
55:18
book because it is the first book ever written where somebody tried to scientifically sit down and study
55:23
vampires. Uh but he was a a churchman. He was a a
55:28
Catholic priest. And so while he was trying to be scientific, he still had all his Catholic ideas about what could
55:35
be real and what couldn't. Certain things aren't possible because, you know, only the devil would could do
55:40
them. So if you were an undead walking corpse, either you were a hoax or you
55:47
were satanic. And so the attempt to be scientific,
55:52
he's trying he's trying to like look at it as science, but he ends up creating his own myths as a result. And it's just
55:58
one of several. Um, but it really does in a weird sort of
56:04
way. Vampire was so big that I mean the reason that Vampire is now owned by a
56:12
different company and the original company is gone and there's another company that pretty much has everything else but not Vampire is because Vampire
56:20
was so big that the guys who made uh Eve Online bought it
56:27
to try and make an MMO of it and somehow couldn't,
56:33
which I think is Wild. It is wild to me that we never got an MMO of this. We
56:38
only got up until recently, we've got bunch of visual novels, only one real
56:44
game, one real computer game out of all this. And now the second one will be out this month.
56:49
Yeah, because Paradox Paradox Interactive owns all of World of Darkness officially.
56:54
Um, and are partnering with Renegade Studios, game studios for modern releases. Um, but yeah, like going back
57:01
to the modernization of of vampire mythology, it it also brought it into
57:06
I don't want to say mainstream, but but it was essentially a perfect time for it
57:12
to influence young minds. And now these young minds are going on to create TV
57:18
shows like What We Do in the Shadows. Like, you cannot look at that and tell me, even though it's a comedy, that you
57:24
go back and look at a lot of the stuff that it's not pulled from some of that same elements. Uh, and then
57:30
did not play play vampire because I'm sure he did at some point. Well, yeah. It's like I think you really have to like say Anne Rice is kind of
57:38
the the inspiration for what if vampires but in the modern
57:43
world. Mhm. But Ann Rice very didn't really explore it very much because she loved like
57:49
certain characters so much that she spent most of her time in their pasts.
57:54
Whereas Vampire took the dare. They're like, "Okay, what if vampires in the
58:00
modern world and they ran with it in a in a real way?" It's it's like she's the she's
58:07
definitely a huge inspiration and you can't take her away from vampires. No, not at all. Uh but at the same time, the vampire
58:14
then went and basically became the inspiration for a lot of people as to what would that actually look like?
58:21
What would that be like? Do vampires just wander around saying, "I'm a vampire." No, because if they did,
58:28
people would kill them. I think uh also should give a lot of credit to the
58:33
modern version of Richard Mat's vampire story, I Am Legend.
58:39
Mhm. Um the the one that was made, the movie, the book, not the movie. Because the
58:44
movies, one movie, The Omega Man, is just weird. And the other movie, I Am Legend, is just they turned it into a
58:51
zombie movie, which is like, why did you do that? Why did you make it a zombie film? We we
58:58
already have zombie films. We have Walking Dead films. This is not that you This is vampires.
59:05
And it's just, it's funny how in many ways the thing that got so many people
59:11
to look deeper was this. I am one of those people. I flat out admit it. The
59:16
reason I got into reading old vampire books and studying vampire lore, the reason I have the giant vampire uh
59:23
encyclopedia in my office is World of Darkness. It got me interested.
59:31
Yeah. I think that's going to do it though for us today. Again, this is just frankly guys,
59:37
we'll be here for a while and honestly, we'll probably revisit this in some capacity and go even deeper into it. But
59:42
this is I promise you I will try to get him to do this because I want to talk werewolf so bad.
59:48
Uh, but this is just a brief overview of the world of darkness and in particular vampire the masquerade. Um, and again,
59:55
you can ask us about anything you want to know about. If you do want us to do an episode on werewolf sooner than later, let us know in the comments. Uh,
1:00:02
send us a message. You can email us at podcastblizardwatch.com. Um, and if you have questions for this
1:00:07
or any of our shows, use that email as well. Just specify the show that it is for and the subject line and any special
1:00:13
pronunciation for your name. Uh, you can also hit us up on Discord. We have the Q and Podcast questions channel. And then
1:00:19
for our Patreon subscribers, we have the Patreon Q and podcast questions channel where we tend to look there first as a way of saying thank you for helping us
1:00:24
keep the lights on. Um, we have a lot of stuff to talk about when it comes to
1:00:30
tabletop in general and I highly recommend you listen to the Tavern Watch podcast. Not just because we make it,
1:00:35
uh, but because we do some fun stuff there. Um, we have a new live. Go ahead.
1:00:41
I was just going to say and we also have more people on it than just the two of us, which is cool because you get more
1:00:46
perspectives. Uh, I really think that Tavern Watch is one of our better shows because it's got a really nice balanced cast.
1:00:52
I would agree. Uh, and then we also do live plays as part of the Tavern Watch. So, every month we do you get three live
1:00:58
play episodes and one podcast like this uh covering various tabletop uh topics
1:01:04
which we have another one uh I think we're ending the spooky one uh this
1:01:09
week. I think the last one goes live and then next week we'll have a uh the uh
1:01:16
normal version of the podcast up and then the week after that we'll start another live play. Um,
1:01:22
join us, check it out. If there's something you want to see us play, let us know. Uh, we try to highlight as many
1:01:28
different games as we can in our our one-shot sessions and, uh, try to bring that joy to you and that discovery.
1:01:35
You want to see us play the vampire? All you have to do is suggest it. It's fair.
1:01:40
But with that, friends, we'll see you next week. [Music]
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