Up next in 10
In preparation for the upcoming WoW patch 11.1 featuring the goblin capital The Undermine, we dive into the evolution of the goblins throughout the history of Azeroth, the difference between the various cartels, and the transition of leadership from the exploitive Gallywix to the more ethical Gazlowe.
Go to https://www.blizzardwatch.com for the latest news on all Blizzard games and don't forget to check out our Patreon if you like what you see and want to support our efforts! https://www.patreon.com/blizzardwatch
Discord: https://discord.gg/MY9p4d7t8U
X: @BlizzardWatch
Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
[Music]
0:09
hello and welcome to lore watch Round Table free form discussion about luring your favorite media I'm your host Joe
0:15
pre one of several lore Focus folks from blizzard watch and I've got my marvelous co-host with me today Matt Rossy how you
0:20
doing today Matt I am infused with pure energy it's all that cashola you've been
0:25
drinking isn't it yes I've been drinking crystallized rocks that they just
0:31
decided when day to drink for no good reason I mean let's let's the weirder
0:37
things have happened in Wild than drinking liquid rocks that come out from the ground but if that doesn't give you a hint of what we're talking about today
0:43
I don't know what will today we are going to be discussing goblins why I probably told them what we were think we
0:48
going to talk about a lot more effectively than a hint maybe you just came out and said it you could have done
0:54
that up front I could have this is this is you being like a goblin yes which is
0:59
you know sometimes more fun uh but yeah we're going to be talking about goblins today because uh coming up very very soon in
1:07
uh world of warcraft's uh retail experience we will be going to the undermine uh which is basically been
1:14
something that the Goblins have been talking about since they were introduced into Warcraft In the Beginning um and
1:19
doesn't that doesn't that kind of freak you out a little bit like because we we remember reading some stuff about Goblin
1:25
Origins and if you consider that stuff combined with some of the stuff we've learned in this expansion I'm starting
1:31
to think that the shadowy figure behind everything is a lot closer to home than
1:37
we think yeah there's a very distinct possibility about that uh but we are
1:42
going to be talking about goblins today and if you have questions about goblins or really anything uh you can go ahead
1:48
and send those in as long as it's lore related I mean and even if it's not if it's for the other show that's fine too
1:53
uh but you can send those into podcast blizzardwatch
2:00
pronunciation of your name uh alongside with it uh if you want to hit us up on Discord we have the Q and podcast
2:05
questions channel uh where you can do the same thing if you're a patreon subscriber we have two different ways
2:11
that you can get a hold of us one is the patron q and podcast questions channel uh where we tend to look there first as
2:16
a way of saying thank you for those of you that are helping us keep the lights on uh and you can also send us messages directly through patreon uh which Liz
2:24
and or Dan will make sure they get to us uh whenever they possibly can so I guess
2:30
we could start talking about Goblin Origins before we start talking about organizations but I don't know how much time we're going to really have to spend
2:36
on it so do you want a shortcut what we know about Goblin Origins okay goblins existed they were kind of weird little
2:42
guys uh mimran the Titan Watcher from uping eloir noticed them and decided to
2:50
mess with them he did some experiments and he seemingly somehow and we don't know how activated their minds and got
2:58
them super creative and super interested in in doing things unfortunately uh and this is one of
3:04
those things where we don't really know what exactly happened he just decided to f off or perhaps something else happened
3:11
which we might talk about we might not and he basically left them alone and the problem is is that without whatever he
3:17
was doing to them they started to lose the ability that they had gained they
3:23
discovered a magic rock that they called a kadite because they for it was on the
3:28
island of Kaja I think it was the Island then but whatever it was it was on the island Kazan and they began using this
3:35
rock to effectively get ideas and see here's the thing it didn't make them smarter it wasn't a this increases your
3:43
intelligence thing they were already pretty smart it's just that they're not they were they they didn't have the kind
3:49
of of intellect that they required for all the inventions they were trying to do holding on to this rock or ingesting
3:57
it in various ways caused them to get ideas like they would suddenly like what if I invented a rocket powered underwear
4:04
and then they would go and do it however their natural intelligence seem to now be aimed at exploitation of things not
4:12
just their ideas but the area around them they would look at a place and go oo what if we sold that or ooh what if
4:20
we got other people to dig that up for us so we didn't have to um and keep in mind for a long time the Goblins entered
4:27
into a period before they found the magic Rock in fact they found the magic Rock because of the trolls specifically
4:34
um oh bloody heck I cannot remember the name they're the biggest most powerful troll at the time thank you the zandalari trolls had enslaved them and
4:41
had them digging up the magic Rock because they were using it in various rituals we even see that uh in battle
4:48
for Azeroth we see that the zandalari still use the kadite type Rock uh to create various magical effects so they
4:55
know it's got something going on too but we didn't actually get to go to undermine in that expansion we're going
5:01
to get to go to undermine in the new expansion uh that's that's a basic really quick and dirty overview of
5:06
what's going on with goblins they had they got monkeyed with or there's more if talk about more great well well no no
5:13
I was just gonna say isn't that a little bit uh that's what we discovered recently because I think back in chronicle volume 1 uh they originated
5:21
from the forest near alir didn't they originally that's that's what they were claimed no they said they originated
5:26
from the forest and he saw them it doesn't say the forest near Old that I can remember if you're if you're right
5:32
you're right yeah because I because I think uh and maybe maybe I'm misremembering this but I'm and I'm the
5:38
Chronicles are within Arms Reach and I'll probably dig through them in a second here but I'm pretty sure that mimran discovered kite first and that
5:46
the Goblins were just small Forest creatures that he decided to experiment on with it and that's what happened with
5:51
him but regardless uh everything else is is pretty accurate um xandar trolls
5:57
being uh not exactly the nicest of people because it is oh I I I wasn't I
6:03
wasn't arguing that kajim might wasn't something meman discovered absolutely it is it is the thing that he was
6:08
experimenting on but I don't see anywhere saying exactly where he found them like I don't see I'm looking right
6:15
now oh no here we are you're right Forest are right near Alo so yeah maybe that is where he found him yeah and I I
6:21
think this goes to like how again things were a lot more connected before the great sundering um because I mean yeah
6:28
for that matter Al we don't know that the we know that the Goblins apparently share a common ancestor with pygmies
6:33
right yes and so it's quite possible that the Goblins ended up scattered
6:40
around because of the they you know yeah well the other thing that we don't know is the aisle of K Kazan could also be
6:48
literally the forests that were around alir because if you look at where the map of aldir is right now it's very very
6:54
north um there are sections of land that could have been broken off and traversed around we also know that our BAS is
7:02
right there as well yeah we also know that when there was a big when it was all one continent
7:07
that there was a giant road going straight south from alir so seeing the forest around alir I mean for that
7:14
matter some of the forest around alir ended up floating with a you know half of alir when they got taken away and
7:20
made into the halls of Valor a lot of stuff happened uh so they don't necessarily have to have they could have
7:26
disseminated them themselves away from that area because oh why did half of it just rip up into
7:32
the sky let's run I mean that there's lots of reasons that they might have moved somewhere else yeah and part of
7:39
the whole thing with the xandari trolls discovering the Goblins too was their search for kite uh because the Xander
7:45
trolls had you know discovered this rock and uh they discovered Kazan In The Goblin race um they use them to help dig
7:54
and then eventually found a vast deposit of uh kite in underneath uh Kazan which
8:02
is where what the undermine is it's this vast Mining City essentially of goblin
8:08
origin uh that is left over from when they were forced to to you know basically take these magic rocks out of
8:16
the ground uh under the guise of the zandalar which leads into the Liberation and trade Wars um which yeah that's the
8:23
the interesting thing too since we're talking about this um basically whatever happened to them the original kite and
8:31
and memon's experimentation it had worn off like they they had they were more or
8:37
less normal and it's the xandi's fault that they got reexposed to it the zandalari forced them to dig it up which
8:44
meant they were now touching it all the time now that's their fault um and also
8:50
their fault is that netharian had insl a bunch of goblins for a while too MH and
8:56
he was forcing them to work with stuff like adamantium and so so forth he was essentially putting them well on mining
9:03
you know the same kind of work that the zandalari would later put them through so there's also more to that too like
9:09
the creation of the demon soul was created with the help of the goblin artificer uh Goblin
9:14
artificers uh led by uh Meo um you know they were the ones that that fashion the
9:19
ananti plates to holdan naran's body together when the Demon Souls power began to overwhelm him uh so essentially
9:26
people kept forcing the Goblins into contact with weird sub Anan elements and then got surprised when they got
9:32
affected by weird Subterranean elements but dur I was going to say during I was
9:37
going to say the The Liberation and trade war is where we start to see goblins take on a more modern form right
9:44
so um it was the casite and the exposure to it that led them to uh sort of become
9:51
what they were by breathing in the dust of the ore uh it it it brought back their intelligence and they started a
9:57
rebellion uh they gathered any materials they could find and hide in order to create a wide range of weapons traps
10:02
explosives and then 100 years before the opening of the dark portal uh the troll
10:08
overseers were overturned uh by the goblin masses when they stormed out of the mines armed with technology that the
10:13
zand delari had never seen before um yeah and also they had the uh the hobgoblins as shock troops which usually
10:21
the the hobgoblins are like pretty docel MH like they they don't like you it's easy to enslave them uh and so the
10:28
trolls didn't think anything of them they're they're not they weren't hard to order around but once the Goblins were ordering them around now they like oh
10:35
but they are ridiculously strong and then Z just were not ready for that no that's not to say that immediately after
10:41
The Liberation was done that the the Goblins all fell into lock step with each other because uh immediately after
10:47
expending the zandalari from the aisle of Kazan they turned on each other uh oh
10:53
yeah big time chaos like well for one thing they kept getting different ideas
10:58
yeah body's getting different ideas from the magic Rock uh about what they should or shouldn't be doing and also I don't
11:06
know how to put this but when when you all have a common enemy it's much easier to provide a united front but once
11:12
they're gone now you start looking around at all the other people going wait a minute why should they let them be in charge of me which I'm I'm me and
11:20
I'm great why shouldn't I be in charge of them and if everybody's thinking that very quickly you Things fall into you
11:27
know kind of shattered pattern and you it's like dropping a mirror now suddenly there's just broken glass everywhere
11:33
yeah and what w up happening is as chaos was going on and as allegiances were being made because allegiances were in
11:38
fact being made um the eventually cartels were formed the ones that we
11:43
know of today uh battles were getting completely out of hand nobody was actually winning uh and it was bad for
11:50
business so what w up happening is that the cartels For Better or Worse brokered
11:56
a bit of a truce the conflict never really ends but it becomes a lot more of a cold war with uh various engagements
12:04
here and there and a whole lot of corporate Espionage uh because that's just how they kind of roll there um but
12:11
the cartels are still Rivals uh they are trying to outsmart each other they're trying to out earn each other uh because
12:18
at the end of the day Goblin Society is still based on one simple fact he who holds the most or sorry they who hold
12:25
the most money wields the most power that's just the goblin way of things um
12:32
and that kind of leads us into where we currently see and have interacted with goblins for I mean Generations at this
12:39
point uh and there are so many good at least several hundred years at the
12:44
minimum probably close to a couple thousand yeah and there are so many different organizations that the Goblins
12:49
belong to um not just the cartels uh because even the uh the cartels have
12:55
subdivisions within them as well right so like there's go ahead there's also C there's cartels that we don't even know
13:01
what they are um there's a trade Prince uh he's in the goblin pleasure Dome I can't remember his effing name but um
13:10
yeah know I can't but if you find him when you uh you're doing gwi's pleasure play Palace you you end up seeing him
13:17
and he's apparently Allied to gwicks at the time and he's he's working with the billw cartel but he's obviously not the
13:25
trade Prince of the bwat cartel because that's gwick so so who is he trade Prince of we don't know we never find
13:32
out um deny deny I think it d n AIS I can't remember because obviously never
13:38
heard it said I just read it in the game but he's got a ton of gold and he's
13:43
apparently doing something but we never find out what well I'm sure I'm sure we're going to at some point but let's
13:49
let's do uh a brief rundown of some of the organizations that we may have dealt with over the years uh and as well as
13:55
the major cartels and I think we can talk about some of the uh the major points of them so we've seen a lot of
14:01
them since Goblin's been around since Warcraft right like the original days of Warcraft they were the ones that you
14:08
know built submarines or uh common deared Turtles um we won't go into too
14:15
much detail about that you can look that up on your own and be sad uh if you so choose uh but we have things like the
14:20
tinkerers union the trade Coalition uh the Ken Blaster boots Inc uh black fuse
14:26
company which we've definitely dealt with them before the undermine Insurance unlimited which we're going to be dealing with soon uh the copper street
14:33
gang uh like little tiny organizations like that and then we have the big cartels such as the Venture company the
14:40
steam Weedle cartel the bilgewater cartel booty Bay which is a cartel uh
14:46
the everlook organization Gadget San ratchet and snuff Inc uh there were some
14:52
others that existed in the RPG books that are not canon yet and might not be
14:58
uh depending on what happens in uh the next uh content release the next tier
15:04
but those are the ones that we've probably dealt with the most The Venture company and the Venture Co mining division are probably the one that we've
15:10
we've been dealing with for the longest amount of time if you go to stranglethorn they're right there they're one of the first ones you ever
15:16
encounter um the next one being booty Bay because them in the black flame are
15:21
literally right there uh bugeat is probably the next most uh I don't want
15:27
to say prevalent um as far as like villains go um but we deal with them a
15:33
lot as well steam Weedle being probably the most neutral of the organizations uh being the mines behind
15:40
the smokywood pastures and uh other groups like that but not without getting their hands dirty the Blackwater Raiders
15:47
are part of that organization as well um so where which Cartel or which one would
15:53
you want to start with Matt what do you think what is the most interesting to you I mean maybe we should talk about the build water just because I mean
16:01
either the bwat or the steam Weedle because both of them have allied with the horde at one time or another the uh
16:07
steam Weedle were very horde focused during the original second war uh and the the billw cartel joined the horde
16:14
after cataclysm so either one of those two I think uh I guess we I'll start with the uh the steam we just because
16:22
they have been around for a while uh I think the steam Weedle might be the first goblins we actually encounter if
16:28
you were playing War craft like they're the ones they're they're neutral right mostly I wouldn't say that then and they
16:35
were very much uh in the in the original first and second war stuff when we first
16:40
meet the steam wheedles they were definitely not neutral they they started off like in their own things like they
16:47
were drove the trolls out of a small town uh stuff like that but they join up with the old horde pretty fast uh and
16:55
Tra trade Prince uh steam Weedle deliberately Allied his cartel with doomhammer um and he was like yeah
17:00
whatever you need all technology whatever so they were they were very far from neutral uh in the first in the
17:06
first in second war um the first war obviously The Horde ultimately won it
17:11
they destroyed um storm uh Storm come on Stormwind thank you Matt geez I could not remember the word storm Stormwind
17:18
it's it's right there Stormwind geez they helped destroy Stormwind they were Alchemists and sappers and all sorts of
17:24
stuff uh they they essentially come in really hard when doomhammer is fully in
17:31
charge of the horde and they are very much a part of how his organization does
17:37
as well as it does uh they provide them with things that they didn't have like for instance a trade Network and boats
17:44
well just also Zeppelins and the Goblin sappers I believe were were part of the
17:49
yeah absolutely sappers Alchemists all that stuff if you see a goblin unit in Warcraft 10 two especially in Warcraft 2
17:56
it's steam wheel uh but after the second War because the second war was a pretty big defeat for The Horde um they kind of
18:03
went like okay we need to not be associated with The Horde anymore because they lost and since they the
18:10
Goblins weren't really very much on Azeroth as side for like a couple of little places like you know uh ratchet
18:17
uh gadgets an it was easier to just kind of pull back yeah to be neutral yeah not
18:25
again I would not I would not describe them as neutral I feel like calling I would call them as neutral at the time
18:32
I'm talking at the time that the second war ended uh it was much less that they were neutral and much more that they
18:37
were not hostile and there's there's a difference there but it I think over the
18:43
then years until the third war it's the third war and the aftermath of the third war that you really see the the the
18:50
steam wheedle cartel going hey you know it's just there's more money in in playing both sides here because here's
18:56
the thing you can't really be neutral between the hord and Alliance before the third war because the horde was done on
19:01
Azeroth it was in camps uh and yet without thr uh basically you know having
19:08
his Uprising getting his his people out and then somehow making alliances with
19:14
these trolls and with the Toren he suddenly created an organization where they didn't have one anymore and a much
19:21
bigger organization in a lot of ways The Horde that we have now was just much
19:26
even at the end just just the beginning of World of Warcraft The Horde that existed at the beginning of World of Warcraft was just so much more complex
19:33
and so much more wide ranging than the horde of you know the first and second
19:39
war that it there's where steam Weedle becomes neutral because they don't want to be part of the horde and risk
19:46
anything like what almost happened happening again they didn't want to have like full-scale war with multiple
19:51
nations in azero but with the hord and Alliance now facing each other there's a
19:56
ton of money to be made in doing all that stuff and you'll notice that the horde never lost its Reliance on Goblin
20:04
technology no but there's another layer to that too which we'll get into when we start talking about the build oh yeah absolutely and but the build water still
20:12
comes in fairly late I I'm what I'm saying is I feel like the the The Horde the the Goblins could be seen almost as
20:19
e economically neutral but providing services to The Horde that the alliance
20:24
didn't or couldn't make use of a lot of it I think was just them being wary
20:29
because they already had the Gnomes and they kind of felt like if we start doing the goblin thing we'll let them learn
20:36
too much about us they'll know too much about us but regardless steam Weedle no longer wanted to be in the in the
20:43
business of fighting alongside either either faction they wanted to be in the business of essentially what do you need
20:51
what what oh we can't help but notice you're in this area and you would like things we happen to have those things
20:57
let's talk and I think the best example of goblin NE neutrality oddly enough is winter
21:04
spring yeah there's that because there's that little Goblin Town up there I can't remember what its name is is it just
21:09
named winter spring or no it's it's something else but that that little town is the perfect example of you go up
21:15
there it's almost a pristine winter you know it's it's on the it's on the cusp of being almost Boreal it's this
21:22
straight up icy cold not tremendously hospitable place and right smack dab in the middle of it there's a bunch of
21:27
goblins making money and that's the kind of thing you that's what steam Weedle really turned into in my opinion that's
21:33
where you can find neutral steam Weedle because they don't those goblins don't care who you are you show up um you
21:41
you've got a like some business that's all they're interested in so that to me is what's fascinating because with with
21:46
the steam wheedle across World of Warcraft and across Warcraft beforehand you get to see Goblin the way Goblin
21:52
minds work in multiple varieties because it's it's always Mercantile the Goblins
21:59
of the first and second war are mercenaries they're not with the old horde because they like them they're
22:04
with the old horde for money the Goblins of the third War and World of Warcraft
22:10
up until today the steam Weedle especially are mercenaries but they don't want to fight with you they want
22:16
to sell you weapons or sell you resources or sell you location and and I
22:24
think that's an interesting switch like the steam Weedle definitely feel like they they changed as an organization but
22:31
not not by becoming less Goblin MH does that make sense like they stay Goblin
22:37
through it all they're always Goblin it's just that they they look at what okay how do we best do this the old
22:44
horde was so hostile that you almost had to join them to make trade with them but
22:50
the new horde isn't and we don't have to really be a member and so I feel like that's what steam weed's neutrality
22:56
comes from that was the most economic viable option uh anything else you want to talk about before we move on no I I I
23:03
think I think that's one of the things that I think is where a lot of the ideas of neutral uh Goblin Hood comes from is
23:10
from the steam Weedle um because of everything you just said because that is again they're the ones that have
23:16
determined at least compared to some of the others that remaining neutral makes the most money and that's what they
23:22
really want that's what their priority is now yeah like if picking sides means that you create a hostile Market Place
23:29
yeah is really where it come down to also the giant sea turtles thing but you've already said that you know you don't know if you want to talk about
23:34
that so for the short version is is that the steam weedles during the original Warcraft game were the ones that after
23:41
they joined the dark or there wasn't the dark cour at the time but after they joined the horde uh they created the
23:47
zeppelins they created the submarines they're the ones that enslaved and created the airtight Shacks uh that were
23:55
part of the back of the giant sea turtles uh so they were not exactly nice
24:01
uh per se and they made a lot of a lot of money off of augen doomhammer so the
24:06
last do you remember what I said earlier that they were like they had a good mind for exploitation I I didn't mean that to
24:12
sound like I thought it was good like morally but in terms of their facility like you put a goblin in a situation and
24:19
he will come up with the best way to exploit it as fast as they can that's
24:24
that's one of the things they're really good at and you even see that with Goblin sham is which we'll talk about later yeah now I think the other thing
24:31
that we'll talk about right now is I think we should talk about the bugeater cartel a little bit because that is
24:36
probably the next most common one for folks to have dealt with because the bwat is uh run by one trade Prince Monty
24:46
well it's Gazo now uh but it was formerly under trade Prince Jester
24:51
Gallow Wix who brought them into the horde if you play a goblin horde member
24:59
you are playing a member of the bwat cartel um they're also one of the largest of the cartels uh which I think
25:06
is also fascinating uh and uh yeah they're not exactly even good for The
25:13
Horde per se I don't know if you want to talk about that at all Matt or I mean
25:19
it's interesting that since we talked about the the fact that you you meet them as a goblin player um they're
25:25
introduced in cataclysm as you pointed out and and although sometimes that may feel like it was yesterday it's actually
25:31
been gez uh 14 years um when they were introduced the bwat had been spoken
25:38
about occasionally but when a player first played a goblin and you first get
25:44
to see like their their above ground stuff on on Kazan and then you see how
25:51
ridiculously terrible uh trade Prince gwick is uh it's one of the first things
25:57
you get to see because Deathwing attacks Kazan and destroys some of it and you
26:03
and a bunch of other people are fleeing the devastation and gwick immediately
26:08
immediately essentially reduces all of the Goblins trying to escape using his
26:13
boats into slaves like he straight up ruins them financially he takes
26:19
everything because he can uh he can do that and it's not until as a goblin you
26:25
basically end up you know Shipwrecked and your character is the reason that
26:30
your the bwat cartel joins The Horde not gwick gwick in fact like the fact that
26:36
gwos came out of that as the trade Prince still is just hilarious it's it's
26:42
one of those moments where you like thr really seriously I get that there's a cataclysm happening but this guy really
26:49
this guy you're gonna put this guy in charge um so yeah gwick is he's a
26:54
character I I don't even know how to explain just how astonish ly good he is
27:00
at at maneuvering but also how incredibly inept he is at actually leading yeah he the worst I was going to
27:07
say I I think leading is not necessarily the right word for it I think he's
27:12
pretty good at leading with an iron fist he's like what you would consider like the old school corporate mentality um
27:19
yeah it yeah I don't disagree with you there I'm just say goe yeah but that's
27:25
that's ruling that's being in charge that's not leading leading is making decisions that are good for you and the
27:32
group you're in charge of and there that's where he is not a viking that's where he is a boat sinking he his every
27:41
every Instinct he has will always be to benefit himself and only himself and he
27:47
will never ever take a decision that will be slightly less profitable in the long run in the short run but will
27:55
benefit more people in the long run that's not gwick G wix's first thing
28:02
when he hears about something is how do I exploit this when when uh Sylvanas
28:08
begins making moves and the leadup to battle for Azeroth he he knows full well
28:13
that she is not trustworthy and she's going to do horrible things with azerite
28:19
but he's thrilled to help her and I think we've talked about this before it
28:24
is through gwick that we get a sense that azerite has a relation to kite yeah
28:31
because he's his his scepter the one that he's had since the very beginning
28:36
it's revealed that it's azerite or at least something between kite and azerite
28:43
right like he yeah he like we don't know when he found it we don't know how long he's had it uh but we do know that it
28:50
has likely been part of the reason he's been able to uh position himself as
28:55
effectively as he has been since the copper Street conglomerate uh and as
29:01
well as push positioning himself as an adviser to the tinkerers Union uh making himself embedded inside of the trade
29:08
Coalition uh and working his way up to being the second in command at the time of trade Prince Mali uh who then you
29:15
know was in charge of the bwat only to be replaced uh by gwick uh who by all
29:22
accounts is smarter and more ruthless than the average Goblin most people have
29:27
have felt way yeah and it's also interesting as we go through as at this
29:33
point you have to say the bwat once once they join The Horde obviously they're a horde organization uh so they don't
29:39
there's not a lot of coexistence with the alliance but even as a horde organization you see a lot of hoorde
29:45
people very wary of gwicks and the bilgewater cartel um and I I don't know
29:54
how to put this like in a lot of ways you can tell that even even his friends
30:00
and allies at the time like when he he comes up with the idea to turn as Shara
30:05
into a giant horde symbol that's gwick gwick is like yeah we'll do this gwick
30:11
gets a lot of ideas many of them make a lot of people go huh and it's I think it's telling that the the main the main
30:20
dungeon run by gwick in battle for Azeroth a lot of horde people go attack
30:26
it because they know there's something wrong here there is something seriously
30:31
wrong with gwick and everything he's doing and I I find that kind of
30:36
fascinating uh there there's just a ton H I don't know it's interesting because are we gonna get to see I one of the
30:44
things I'm interested to see is how much of of we see of the bwat uh fairly soon right or is that already out like the
30:50
patch dropped no the patch hasn't dropped yet so we're we're we were going to be seeing them as a prominent factor
30:56
in uh the I so far the only thing that we've really seen with the bwat in game
31:02
is uh gwick being ousted from control of the primary uh belw waterer uh and gazlo
31:09
taking over uh basically gazlo formed a goblin Union within the bwat uh took
31:15
them over uh and is now trying to lead them uh to more sustainable Futures uh
31:22
including so much as showing them hey you know you you don't necessarily need to cut Corners to maximize profit profit
31:28
because if it blows up and you can't use it again you've just wasted all that money uh and then them going I never
31:33
thought of it that way huh fascinating or yeah and it's also interesting it's
31:39
also interesting since you point that out we should talk briefly about the fact that gasow himself is a figure
31:45
who's essentially been part of like multiple cartels at this point yeah and
31:50
because because because he's he was very much a part of um not ratchet no it was ratchet wasn't it uh D's major operation
31:57
was ratchet not kind of so yeah he was he was part of the steam Weedle for a
32:02
long time when it was in ratch in uh being in control of Ratchet um he was also then part of uh Mega uh the Grease
32:10
Monkeys and then eventually The Horde console which is where he's at right now
32:15
um the mechanical engineer Guild of Azeroth is Mega uh so he at one point
32:21
was just like I just want to build stuff um you know he's the one that was part
32:26
part of that whole sponsoring uh races at fizzle and posic speed bags and thousand needles uh the other races that
32:33
used to take place in the charred Veil uh so it's he's been around and he's
32:39
been in part of many different organizations but not nearly as many as gwick was but the the other side is
32:48
aside from his association with the bwat under gwick most of his associations
32:53
have been clean and as a goblin goes that is unheard heard of he's probably
32:59
the most respectable and I say that with air quotes of the Goblins we've really interacted with uh and originally uh he
33:08
was a Warcraft 3 Hero by the way if in case people forget uh in The Frozen
33:13
Throne uh he was a sapper which is always fascinating to so
33:18
it it is you know the Bild are today probably the most common goblins you see
33:25
because you know if you're playing a horde the goblins that are in The Horde with you are bilgewater um and they're
33:31
led by gasow now and has been have been for like an expansion or two now right when did GIS get kicked out uh end of
33:39
last expansion I want to say well I know that he was still um G was still I mean
33:44
end of end of battle for Azeroth I think yeah he was still lied to uh Sylvanas until she went through the portal and
33:50
everything and then he was like okay I guess that's I guess I hear the writing on the wall there uh but gwis and and
33:58
garash got along really well uh garash was a lot of money for gy wigs and so
34:03
yeah it's well gar also also lacked the level of scrutiny that it probably was
34:08
required yeah exactly that's nothing Gazo liked better than being able to take not Gazo gwick liked better than
34:15
being able to like take cut those Corners that gazo's like don't cut the corners um but I I will say that right
34:21
now the bwat are probably the biggest day-to-day Guild like they're the most
34:26
most well-known Goblin cartel because they're the ones who most if you're gonna again if you're playing hord you
34:33
see a goblin player he's in the build waterer like the Goblins who are NPCs in your in your hord towns they're in the
34:40
buge water that's who they are um if you go to a neutral location like say again
34:45
gadgets and or ratchet then the Goblins the NPCs that you see in the goblin charact you know those goblins are more
34:51
likely to be steam wheed um but you know that doesn't mean that there's there's like a ton more as Joe pointed out
34:56
there's more cartels there's more sub cartel there's groups that are not cartel sized but are still their own
35:04
individual organizations there's a lot of different goblins out there uh should
35:09
we talk about the venger company go for it Venture company is probably the next the next one like I said I think we've
35:14
dealt with it the most as a and I'm an to air quote villain here because they are they're super capitalists is really
35:21
the best way to yeah like well for instance as as you know the motherload they were the ones that took over the
35:27
mother Lo on Kazan yeah their their biggest claim to fame is is exploiting azos natural resources regularly yeah I
35:34
mean if you played uh if you're in war you know wild classic right now or if you played back in the day uh Every Time
35:41
You Came Upon goblins doing something that you didn't want them doing it was almost certainly the Venture comp
35:46
because like steam Weedle cartel didn't want to fight if they could avoid it um
35:52
and the bwat like I said they they joined the horde and they were like kind of existed before that but but we didn't
35:58
really see them that often so it was almost always the Venture company when they were clear cutting a forest like um
36:04
Stone Talon uh absolutely all that's all venture company guys um if you go to
36:10
mulgore and you find the Goblins there that's the The Venture company the ones
36:15
uh they even like in in battle not battle forth uh burning Crusade uh the
36:20
ones on Azure m style that that's that's them um the ones in stranglethorn Veil
36:26
uh Eastern King sholazar base and all over the place Grizzly Hills if you find
36:32
goblins doing something that we don't want them to be doing it's almost certainly the Venture company uh who
36:39
sometimes call themselves The Venture Trading Company or just venture or Venture Co um this cartel is it it would
36:48
be fair to say they're neutral in that they don't care who they who they rip off well which is interesting because
36:53
there's one there's one caveat to that which was grimma fizzle crank in uh
37:00
dragonflight uh was sent by The Venture company up up to basically see what the
37:06
prospects were going to be on the island uh but apparently upon seeing the beautiful landscape decided uh no we
37:14
this is not viable at this time which is very ungoing like of the Venture company
37:19
um so while there is it's really not their normal which is while there is a spa there uh there is no longer a there
37:26
is no natural resource exploitation uh happening there very very interesting I
37:32
think that that has something to do with the fact that there's a whole lot of really big Angry Dragons in that area
37:38
yeah and goblins aren't stupid they're they're they're often greedy they can be
37:43
immoral but they're not morons um and so it's at least I gotta
37:49
say it's at least a thumb on the scale of of doing the right thing for ones because you know on the one hand sure we
37:56
could probably make a lot of money here but on the other hand have you seen how many dragons there are yeah there's a
38:01
lot of dragons here yes so many uh and also I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out that the goblin is in facted let's
38:08
just say it wouldn't shock me that is entirely possible have we seen a dragon who's chosen a goblin form yet I don't
38:15
recall off the top of my head but we've seen a few gnomes so it's at least in within the Realms of feasibility yeah so
38:20
that would be wild if that turns out to be the case uh but I'm definitely here for it if it is uh but that said like
38:28
Matt's right if you've ever experienced like the oil rigs the drilling the uh I
38:34
think they're even present on the uh I think it's I think it's them on the uh
38:40
siren ises if I'm doing all the the the digging exploring and exploding of caves
38:45
I'm not th% sure but it sounds like something they would do um so like I mean I'm not pretty sure it's
38:53
them uh so they're everywhere and you you've likely dealt with them at some point and if you haven't dealt with them at
38:59
some point you will be um I don't know what their role is going to be in the next content release though since again
39:06
we're going after mainly uh G Wix and his uh Casino SL attempt to uh get more
39:14
money and therefore get more power within Goblin Society again yeah it should be pointed out that the Venture
39:20
company um actually have been enemies to gxes because they were the ones who
39:26
attacked the motherload um creating like a situation where you know people are like I don't like either of these groups
39:31
uh the Venture company is usually headed by by Moguls not trade princes even
39:37
though it's basically the same deal it's it's a difference it's a it's kind of like a being a trade Prince or it's kind
39:43
of like being it's more like a president of the company it's more like a president of the company but regardless
39:49
um they they are not they're simultaneously like almost like you know
39:54
per like personifications of goblin and yet also they're kind of distinct in
40:00
Goblin culture in that they are the most aggressive goblins you're going to run into like they are the ones most likely
40:06
to jump into a giant robot Mech with a goblin face and and buzs saww hands and try and kill you um the steam Weedle are
40:14
certainly not averse to trying to kill you but they're not eager to do it and the bilgewater joined the horde so they
40:21
know sometimes we're going to have to kill people but again they're not looking to do it uh you show up and
40:27
event company place you could just be trying to ride through on your way somewhere else they're going to try to kill you because they are very
40:34
determined that nobody else they are like seagulls going mine mine mine mine
40:39
mine in in both meanings of the word uh they're they're simultaneously strip mining everything and also they don't
40:45
want you anywhere near their stuff that's a really great way to put it like they're they're they're essentially the ones that get the claim first and then
40:50
protect that claim by whatever means necessary yeah they don't they do not care uh why you are there you shouldn't
40:57
be there and they will attack you and that's something I think it's one of the reasons Gazo ended up um running the
41:05
bwat for The Horde is because Gazo had experience in working with other people
41:11
who aren't goblin and the Venture company has always hated him and has tried to kill him on numerous occasions
41:18
uh they've tried to take over you know they wanted to take over like undermine
41:23
they wanted to take over ratchet they wanted to take over Gadget xand The Venture company are the most aggressive
41:30
goblins who aren't Gil Goblin or gilbin uh so yeah that there's there's a lot to
41:35
that in my opinion it's it's interesting to see the Venture company operate but yeah I definitely think that they're not going to they might in fact be an
41:42
antagonistic force uh when we go uh after I want say GLE but I mean gxes
41:49
they might be like a h Force when we go after gwick but they're not going to be working with them yeah and I mean that
41:54
is we don't know exactly what we're going to be doing we do know that we're going to be aligning ourselves with one
42:00
of the cartels um when we get there we're going to be essentially picking
42:06
one of them to back whether it's the bwat or steam Weedle or even the Venture company uh they're all options for us to
42:14
uh sort of uh get in line with uh and whatever we do is all at the behest of
42:21
making sure that uh G Wix doesn't get more power or uh disrupt things more
42:28
than they are because I think that's really the concern right is undermine is
42:34
the center of goblin Commerce and maybe we should talk about like undermine in
42:39
general uh I mean what we know about it uh or you know what we what its current
42:46
state is um well I think that would be you for the simple fact that I just talked a lot and also because I don't
42:53
know as much about under you which is fair uh so it is the capital city of the
42:58
the Goblins right it is uh the again the the site of the Revolution the site of where they they essentially were born as
43:05
a goblin race it's underneath the bowels of Mount uh Karo uh which is an active
43:12
volcano uh just going to throw that out there um and it's what you see exploding
43:17
in the opening sequence in cataclysm which brings the Goblins to The Horde or
43:23
at least that particular sect of goblins um the it's basically a giant complex City uh
43:32
it's got a bunch of network of tunnels that lead into it vaults tubes of lava uh that are used to illuminate and heat
43:37
the city uh as well as be redirect through there um it has what they call slle towns uh which are essentially uh
43:46
for lack of a better term it's a real life thing where you uh if you've ever seen a minor panning for gold inside of
43:54
a uh like an old movie about the gold rush that's what those are they're towns that
44:00
have founded themselves at the edge of a a river or water body that carries
44:06
natural resources uh or precious resources in this case uh I believe it's
44:12
casite um but in real life it would be like gold or silver deposits or iron deposits uh through the waterways that
44:18
can be panned out um those are there uh and there's one of the interesting
44:25
things is you can troll slaves in the undermine turns out not all of the
44:32
trolls got out when the revolution occurred uh and there is a uh for the
44:38
bwat basically hold a good chunk of it um including the port uh that's there
44:44
but it is essentially the gigantic Metropolis of the the the goblins and
44:52
I'm going to be fascinated to see it because it's one of those things where
44:57
we've been teased it for a very long time so long so long uh it was well
45:02
before well before cataclysm like they before we ever knew anything about Kazan other than the fact that it existed uh
45:09
we've been hearing about undermine we heard about undermine I think in in Warcraft 2 we heard about it in Warcraft
45:15
2 when the the Goblins were were first really kind of like coming up to speed uh we also heard about it in the
45:22
original Warcraft manual so if you got Warcraft vanilla when it first released there was a very
45:29
thick book that came with it and in that book was a lot of stuff that never made it to live servers at that time that we
45:36
would find that would come later whether it was uh dwarf Mages or in this or the
45:43
the the dragon Isles or uh in this case Kazan we wouldn't get there till much
45:48
later but it was also present in the the warcraft RPG and again while it is
45:54
considered non-canon uh the depiction of it was like this Cy like Las Vegas style City
46:02
uh that the trade princes controlled their their private armies and trade fleets and led them as if they were
46:08
1930s mob bosses uh or or you know at the time and
46:13
I find that absolutely fascinating because what we're seeing in the the
46:19
previews for going to undermine is that some of that was actually preserved
46:25
because what are we doing that we're going there to essentially disrupt G wix's casino and he's running it as if
46:30
it was an offshoot of like the movie Casino um we do know that there is also
46:36
many other areas of the undermine that aren't necessarily purely based off of
46:43
the cartels themselves uh there are tons of of Alchemists and tinkerers uh that
46:50
that are not essentially part of anything but are part of the trade Coalition that are based out of here uh
46:57
that are more than happy to sell their wees to whoever wants something to explode um we know that there are tons
47:03
of of experimental shops here for weapons and armor um and we know that
47:10
this is where hobgoblins are originated from we are probably going to learn more
47:16
about the origins of hobgoblins because again Matt pointed out that they're docile they're also not very intelligent
47:23
they're if you remember trolls and we had that big long episode episode of trolls we talked about the troll
47:29
Berserkers that they're giant they're not necessarily the smartest creatures
47:34
um hob goblins are kind of in that same category and you know if you go
47:39
to um the deadmines one of the first bosses you you come across is a
47:46
hobgoblin with a goblin that rides his back um but it's it's going to be
47:51
fascinating to see their origin I think because they've been around forever for
47:57
such a long long time and we don't really know where they like how they came to be like what are they we there's
48:04
one of the rivals one of the arguments is that they were made by goblins um I
48:09
think it's said uh um I can't remember who said this but something about you take a goblin make it fatter bigger
48:17
stupider and uglier and you have a hobgoblin add to that a nasty mean streak and we've got a problem um
48:22
something like uh I have to go look that up again where I got from but I know it's from somebody but there's some kind
48:28
like it's there's arguments that they are basically regular goblins who are altered by Alchemy uh and one
48:34
description and this one I'll freely admit uh I I find hilarious is that they're dumber than an ogre with a
48:39
hangover um so what's going on with the Gob goblins why do they exist why would
48:46
goblins make them obviously they're probably pretty good shock troopers but we also know they were we know that they
48:52
existed during the time that trolls were in control yeah so it's very possible that the trolls them and then the the
48:58
Goblins basically managed to get them to you know say Hey you know we're related you should help us kill those guys um
49:04
but regardless their first appearance was in cataclysm uh and so we saw them with the bilgewater uh and the dominance
49:11
offensive apparently brought in heavy mukes uh which is hob you know
49:17
hobgoblins hobgoblins muks is one of their titles that's not my fault I didn't name them that uh I know moo has
49:23
problems Joe is in the past has schooled me on moo but that's what they're called him the the game um so yeah you've
49:29
you've got that too that they're being used by shock troopers and they can also be affected by kadite just like a normal
49:36
Goblin like you can make a smart uh hobgoblin if you kadite him up and that
49:41
to me that's fascinating why is nobody experimented more with this idea man so
49:47
we'll see what happens with that I would love to see more I I mean I'll be up front with you I would love it if if
49:53
hobgoblins became a playable race uh I don't care if they're race or what I I would just love it if they were an
49:59
option like I'd love it if we ended up getting something weird like Alliance would get
50:04
ogres and The Horde would get hobgoblins i' be like why did the alliance get get
50:09
ogres oh because of the ones on on dror the ones that have their own whack Empire and don't like The Horde very
50:14
much so yeah uh but I would love to see more from the hoglins they're they're one of my one of my favorite things
50:20
because we know nothing about them and it's been almost it's been over a decade yeah and to talk more about the
50:26
where we're going to the undermine one of the things that patch 11.1 is promising uh is that we're going to be
50:33
really understanding the way that Goblin Society works and it's not just an industrial complex there are homes here
50:40
there are streets of uh where drag racing is going to take place there's an entire culture here that we have never
50:48
seen uh anything other than glimpes or just yeah barely seen in the original
50:53
the original uh goblin starting thing when you were playing in cataclysm you started your your Goblin character you
51:00
got a little tiny glimpse of it yeah and we're going BEP and we do know that we are going to be working with the four
51:06
major cartels uh where we're going to get to choose who we want to to back with uh whether it's the BGE water under
51:13
the control of our good friend gazlo uh the steam Weedle the Blackwater or the
51:19
even the Venture company because again the Venture company G Wix is bad for
51:24
business gwick has still control over a good chunk of the undermine because even
51:30
though he's out of The Horde even though the bwat have sort of you know kicked
51:36
him out of their their main control he's got a lot of money he's got a lot of money and the gaggio his his main uh
51:44
source of income I think at this point uh goblins love to gamble and we know that for a fact um yeah but that has
51:52
been one of the major ways he's made money this whole time that's what the whole deal in and Shara was mhm uh he it
51:59
was a it was another casino he keeps loving he loves the things because you know it really appeals to goblins
52:06
because the idea is hey we're smart so we'll we'll obviously win this Gamble and we'll get money for nothing getting
52:12
money for nothing is just the Dream It's the goblin dream if there was an actual tree that just dumped money when you
52:18
shook it goblins would never leave it you know they would die of thirst trying to shake more money out of the tree so
52:24
yeah it go you know and yet at the the same time they're smart enough to know that the house always wins so they
52:30
always want to be the one in charge of the casino yeah if you want the money and The House Always Wins you become the
52:36
house that's the goal uh and again the just not to put too fine a point on it
52:41
because we only have a few minutes left um but it's one of those things where we're going to learn the
52:48
true uh the true depth of goblin transactional relationships and Matt
52:54
talked about this a little bit earlier goblins are very good at transactions
53:00
everything they do is a transaction um even the stuff that that Gazo does is a
53:06
transaction if you go back and read the short story and you go back and like do the stuff in battle for Azeroth where
53:12
he's you know kind of getting people on his side it's all transactional hey you
53:18
get more benefits if you come over here it's not hey this is better for you this is the right thing to do it's no you get
53:25
something out of this and showing them what they get out of it and what they need to give him in return and making it
53:33
so that they agree with that transaction we're going to see more about that it makes them very good at things like even
53:39
as I remember way back when Goblin Shaman were first introduced to the game
53:44
and EV there was a lot of very upset people until you realize and we talked
53:50
about this I talked about this for I think hours at some point um everything that a shaman does on unless it is a
53:57
dark Shaman anything they do is transactional with those Spirits it's asking them to do things it's not
54:04
forcing them to do things unless again you are a dark Shaman goblins excel at
54:10
that at getting things to do what they want by basically brokering that
54:15
transaction and so they are very good Shaman whether it is working with a fire Elemental to Reign destruction down upon
54:22
the enemies or working with water Elementals to heal or the Elementals to
54:27
to whisk away uh them from danger whatever the case is they excel at it
54:33
because they understand they want something from this we want something from this let's find that neutral ground
54:40
and we're going to about to have an entire update entire patch that is all of that personified in an entire
54:46
civilization and I'm kind of excited to see how that works out because it's not just about gold Gold's a pretty big part
54:52
of it but I mean gold is one form of profit but you can in a lot of different
54:57
ways um and profit can mean a lot of different things and anytime there is
55:02
profit to be had goblins goblins are essentially very good at it goblins are the only ones who can can basically step
55:09
up to the Brokers and and talk in their language they're the ones who the ethereals ethereals have tons of cartels
55:16
the ethereals can't beat them when it comes to understanding benefiting
55:22
yourself through an action goblins are among the masters of it they are just very good at this yes but I think that's
55:30
going to do it for today unless you have anything else uh that wish we talked about the Blackwater Raiders more but
55:36
you know time time does run away from you well maybe maybe there'll be a second episode where we go into more detail about some of these smaller
55:43
ones but for now folks I do want to thank you for joining in blizzard watch is made possible due to the generous
55:49
contributions at patreon.com blizzardwatch your continued support means that this podcast siging Community is able to thrive and grow blizzardwatch
55:56
supporters enjoy exclusive benefits like early access to the podcast better tested having your question answered on our podcast for the q& and Nets resite
56:02
experience if you have questions for this or any of our podcasts be sure to
56:07
send those in to podcast blizzardwatch dcom specify the show that it is for uh
56:14
inside of the subject line and any special pronunciation of your name if you want to hit us up on Discord you can
56:19
we have the Q and podcast questions channel that assigned for the same thing uh and if you want to head us up and you're a patreon subscriber we have the
56:25
patreon Q podcast questions Channel where we tend to look there first as a way of saying thank you you can also
56:31
send those in on patreon uh if you want to send them in that way uh and we will be sure to get those uh into our grubby
56:38
little hands uh and we will add them to the shows as we possibly can but with that folks we'll see you next week
56:47
[Music]
#Online Video
#Virtual Worlds
#Other