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Join us as we discuss where new class halls could be given some iconic ones were destroyed when Dalaran fell from the sky. Also, more exploration of the true nature of Beledar, the crystal that lights Hallowfall. Spoiler: It all ties into the Titans, because of course it does.
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[Music]
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hello and welcome to lur watch Round Table free form discussion about Laur a favorite media I'm your host Joe pre one
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of several L Focus folks from blizzard watch and I've got my co-host with me of immense magnitude Matt Rossy how you
0:22
doing today Matt apparently I'm fat we're just big and I mean compared to me
0:28
everybody's really tall so you know that yeah I I'm just you know usually when someone says something's of enormous
0:33
magnitude they're not talking about how tall it is but you also have a pension for like playing like Giants and giant
0:39
kin in the games that we've played recently so you know there's that as well yeah the last one I played was a
0:46
dwarf wasn't it yeah you were kind of a dwarf she was genetically a dwarf she
0:52
was seven she was like six and a half feet tall but she was a dwarf although I gotta say this is a
0:58
this is a quick swerve and then we'll get back to watching but I don't know that that rule made it into uh the 2024
1:05
players handbook which one because I was looking the one where if you said had a human and an elf you could just pick
1:12
between like you know looking like a human and being an elf or vice versa yeah no it's in there because there's no
1:19
find it yeah there's no there's no more uh and we could talk about this during a
1:25
Tavern watch or even on a pre-show no more half elves and no half Orcs I got that but couldn't find like you know you
1:32
are half dwarf like there just it wasn't anything I could you just you just choose how you look now that's really
1:38
all it is so like you you just get to to cart blanch choose how you look which is
1:43
fine um honestly it's probably for the best because it it cuts out on a lot of other stuff so but we're not here to
1:49
talk about that today although we could probably fill an entire show just talking about our hot takes about the new uh Dungeons and Dragons books cuzz
1:56
man oh man there's still much more to say about those but we're here to answer your questions our wonderful listeners
2:03
if you have questions for this or any of our podcasts be sure to send those in to podcast blizzardwatch outcom specify the
2:10
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2:17
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2:23
you are patreon subscriber you can also hit us up the patron q and podcast questions Channel where we tend to look
2:28
there first as a way of saying thank you for helping us keep the lights on uh and if you are a patreon subscriber you can
2:33
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form of meme something cat related almost always so you get that extra benefit of knowing that it your question
2:45
came to us with uh Dan's Personal Touch added to it but without further Ado
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let's get into the questions this one comes from acree uh going through the
2:56
war within intro scenario for the 15th time I got to thinking along with the destruction of our favorite floating
3:02
fortification two and only two of the class Halls have also been blown the smithin I've always maned a mage first
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and a rogue second so this is kind of a double loss for my crew here to sve the wound where are some places that the
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terus guard and the uncrowned could set up shop I think the whole world would be up for grabs excluding uh Warlords of
3:23
dror and maybe Argus so where can each class meat that feels thematically fitting and every respective member can
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reasonably agree on you know House Hunters but magic and not so thoroughly
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staged so I I think that the Mage order Hall is going to be tied with what
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inevitably will be the rebuilding or Recreation of of dollon right I don't think doon's gone for good I think that
3:50
we get a new city go ahead um isn't the Mage order Hall technically speaking in
3:55
an extradimensional space yes so it's still in the exra dimensional space we just can't access it unless we could
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cast another spell to tie us to it I I feel like it doesn't have to go anywhere
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so what Joe is saying yeah they'll rebuild doin they'll just build a new portal to it oh actually rebuild doin
4:14
then I actually you know I'm thinking about it I don't know if that's true it's part of the Violet Citadel and the
4:19
Violet Citadel the whole deal it's got the special Vault and so they had to like seal it off from from all
4:26
dimensional threats and stuff I I that's what I thought I don't remember uh I think you can't actually access it
4:31
without going to Dollar on because of that yeah I whatever it's a weird the
4:37
the V is a weird spot uh spot it's it's another Tardis situation I guess would be the best way to put it what we see uh
4:44
physically represented is definitely not as large as it actually is inside uh because I mean it's got the grand
4:50
Library there it's houses the Council of tears fall um the there's a vault below
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the Violet Citadel where the dreadlord uh what it katron AER uh was trapped so
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there's a ton of stuff there storm thing
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yeah the Rogues the Rogues had a physical place it was in the sewers I remember that um honestly I feel like to
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a certain degree having an order Hall was weird for the Rogues like but I mean
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if you're going to look for hey here's a central location for all rogery there are some possibilities
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um the r Raven coft is that's the name right the there's that the it used to be
5:36
a faction that you have to to learn to unlock loock boxes oh yeah I I can't
5:41
remember what it was yeah but those guys you could go there and just build something in there Ren Court Raven Court
5:47
okay whatever uh you could build something there right because you it's not on Alliance or hord ground it's an
5:54
alterac um so you could just build it there I mean I know that right now The
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Horde and Alliance what they control in the area is kind of not completely settled but at this point the hord and
6:06
Alliance are getting along better anyway so you could just recreate it there or you could put it um in some place
6:12
completely neutral like we got a whole expansion where we're going to sir we're going to siren's aisle next in this
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expansion and then after that it's looking like we're going undermine maybe we could put it in undermine you know
6:24
cuz God knows goblins like to steal things I mean and gnomes like to steal things so maybe we could get everyone
6:30
together to just build a floating island uh of thievery a big robot island of
6:36
steeling stuff I don't I just you know Rogues I feel like they could do a lot of different things yeah Rogues are probably the
6:43
easier of the two but going back to uh Mages I think I think you're going to
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find one of two options probably the most palpable one might actually be on
6:55
the dragon Isles right because we have a good relationship with the blue Dragon flight again we have access to their
7:02
library now uh which we didn't have before and I could see the mes oh dude
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dude you just made me think of something go ahead karazon it will never be
7:13
karazon kazon man it could totally be kazon it will never be karazon I mean
7:21
cadar is around and he uses the library in karazon I don't know man I honestly
7:26
kind of like the idea of kazon or upside down kazon even while I think a lot of people would would probably enjoy that I
7:33
don't think it'll ever happen because it is uh a maybe a little too story Centric
7:38
in a lot of places and things uh but going back into the the the Spiel here
7:43
so the thought is that they could do something with the blue dragon flight and possibly have themselves a nice little cozy uh niche of an area
7:51
especially since we cleared out a lot of the um weird magic stuff that was going on there and brought the blue dragon
7:57
flight back um oh but dude about the blue dragon flight I mean another possibility comes to mind give them the
8:03
Nexus the dragons could be like oh we don't need that anymore now that we're back in the dragon ises you can have the Nexus it's true they could give them the
8:10
the Nexus up in cuara yeah and now you've got like a a really well-defended out of out in the middle of nowhere
8:17
place um but I don't they want that blue dragons there yeah but I don't know I
8:23
don't know that they want it because it doesn't it doesn't have the magic anchoring that it used to no but it's
8:28
still got magic anchoring the reason it was built in the first place was that it was over a lay line Nexus it doesn't
8:34
have to be the Juiced up one where they were directing everything to it but originally I thought that was I thought
8:41
that was not n La line Nexus I thought it was literally where they were pulling it to they had originally a layline
8:46
Nexus there they then tried to plug everything else into that one they were basically trying to move everything to one Nexus rather than the multiple
8:53
layline nexuses but again there's also the possibility that we will just rebuild Dollar on because that is a
8:58
conversation that I think will happen uh it might not be the floating magical City that it once was but maybe they'll
9:05
put it back where it used to be that's what I was just going to say is that there's a a wonderful crater there that
9:11
is unused right now um actually is is the crater still unused I mean did they
9:17
have a bubble still over it I have no idea there it's a still a pit that you fall into and die okay so they could
9:23
very easily use their magic maybe with a little help of uh some of the other faction maybe maybe get some uh Shaman
9:31
and Druids in there to help the the land sort of fill back in uh make the land a little bit easier to to to build on and
9:38
then bring everything back cuz I think I liked the idea of the Violet Citadel quite a bit I like the idea that it was
9:46
sort of this what we declared an ultra an extradimensional space I like what it
9:51
represented and I thought it was a really cool to have the Hall of the Guardian be there right because that's
9:57
where the Hall of the Guardian was originally before uh medivh decided that uh Kazan is where I'm going to be
10:04
hanging out by uh so having that little piece of history there that ties it all together I think is really neat uh and
10:11
also if it is an extradimensional space rebuilding with your safe cards to have direct access to it would be really
10:18
intriguing and a cool little story Rogues can set up anywhere and I don't know that one makes more sense than
10:24
another thousand needles why thousand needles isn't it still a giant you can
10:30
build a giant party pirate ship that's like a big steampunky crazy thing with a casino on it and just cuz then they have
10:37
one of those there so just take that over and now you've got this rolicking crazy place where like people can just
10:43
come and do all sorts of nutty things because nobody controls the area there's no The Horde or the alliance control it
10:49
so yeah just it's Rogue Island I'm from Rhode Island originally so I like Rogue
10:54
Island that's a thing but regardless yeah no totally give him give him a crazy boat I don't know why I'm fixated
11:00
on the idea of of Ro I have no idea either but just you know like y one guy
11:07
going shiver me timbers the other guy's going that why are you talking like that so yeah no I I totally want to get I
11:12
want to give him a big old boat and thousand needles there's also other options as well I mean if you're really
11:18
hellbent on the whole pirate theme you could always go do something with the c Tian Islands uh and set yourself up uh
11:24
in they have a boat and they can go anywhere they want so you could just have them show up on cult teris if they
11:31
want to be there but I think the whole point is that if it's a rogue Society they probably want to be a little
11:37
private or not exactly broadcast their whereabouts uh especially for these
11:43
Rogues in WoW ever I've never seen like Rogues may say that kind of thing but my
11:49
god do they not live up to it they definitely did with the original order Hall it was in the sewers uh tucked away
11:55
in the middle of uh underneath dollon it wasn't exactly publicly broadcast where it was I mean I knew where it was and
12:01
it's me if I know where it is it's not that hard to find sure we can we can talk about that but I mean there's also
12:08
all these uh abandoned structures throughout Azeroth that they could possibly overtake or or take over as
12:13
well right how many Elven lodges are no longer used after uh the cataclysm or uh
12:21
how many abandoned temples are there all throughout the world they could literally set themselves up anywhere the
12:27
question is what would be the most central location or the most neutral
12:33
location for them to do so uh and I would say Obviously Sten away from like
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you know the Warlords of drain or uh because that's a whole other weird
12:45
situation that we still haven't really dealt with although we might now that the uh infinite Dragon flight and the
12:50
bronze dragon flight are sort of playing nice with each other um but you could also see maybe not going to uh I mean
12:59
Shadow lands is probably going to be off off you know yeah you're you're not going to want do anything there there's
13:05
not that many things to steal from I mean once you get to a certain point you're it's just all Ena anyway and
13:10
doesn't spend anywhere so yeah I don't know it would probably not be one of the major cities because I mean Espionage is
13:16
one of the things um the fact that it was dollar one point was more of a neutral
13:22
thing if you're if you're talking about Rogues and you're trying to make him all seem like stealthy spies and not the you
13:27
know brawling pirate type um one thing you could do is have every city has like a weird creepy speak easyy
13:34
that you go to and you knock on a door and you you say the CW word and they take you down and through a method that
13:40
nobody understands because it doesn't seem to be a portal you end up in the Rogue order Hall and it's like you know
13:47
how did we do this well we stole something now we can do this and that way you don't know where this where it is you know how to get to it you know
13:54
Rogues know how to get there and that's it there is no established place it is
13:59
heck maybe they're they're they actually stole the Mage order all I was just going to say maybe they steal a piece of
14:05
the Violet Citadel since it's just kind of sitting on the beach there like oh this Crystal leads to an extra dimensional pocket space hm I wonder if
14:11
we can use this maybe I can see something like that or or it could even be like you know every time you every
14:17
time someone tells you about it it's a completely different story and you're like I have no idea how what this place is or how we got here but we got it so
14:23
yeah or it could even be like some plane we've never really visited like a kind of like World of Warcraft version of the
14:31
of the realm of greed from Diablo like there's even like that place o the place in Pandaria that's like that the one you
14:38
do the treasure runs with all the chests and stuff you you know the one I'm talking about uh yeah that's with
14:44
thunder so we could go there it's not like the mou were doing anything with it right now that's entirely Fair th those
14:50
are options as well the safe to say Rogues are probably the easiest one that they can just kind of like Rog yeah
14:56
roges are spoiled for Choice um every dungeon and and raid we've plundered
15:01
every you know weird location we've been to they could they could be aase for it becoming a rogue order Hall like it's
15:07
just it's just not hard all right well I think that answers that question uh
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hopefully at least uh I think we're going to move on to the next one though so thank you very much AR arre or arre F
15:20
our next question comes from verdigre uh in the semi-weekly quests that unlock
15:25
messages from arcadis he revealed that badar is a natural part of azeroth's
15:30
essence and he speculated that there are other similar crystals elsewhere in the world perhaps aligned with other Cosmic
15:36
forces supposing the other crystals are similarly of a dual nature isn't it
15:42
interesting to wonder what biomes may be flourishing around a chaos order and Life Death cycle Crystal so it's
15:50
interesting because again it's a speculation on aradus part right it's not unknown they didn't find anything
15:57
else uh and I don't know how hard they were looking um and also we don't know
16:04
if it was the cavern itself was a naturally occurring thing where badar is
16:10
or if it was a result of something like Yash Raj being plucked out of the earth and the tendrils being like stolen away
16:17
or you know pulled out with him or them or however you uh do a seven-headed
16:23
gigantic monstrosity that is all consuming um but there is a POS
16:28
possibility that there are other crystals that are of a similar dual nature maybe that's part of the first
16:35
one's plans maybe that's part of what they were trying to do in the first place maybe this comes back to something
16:41
that I've been talking about for years where Azeroth might be the perfect center of the cosmology uh bear in mind
16:49
that I believe the fourth Chronicle came out this year and we have not read it yet so uh it's one of those things where
16:55
I don't think we can really talk about anything in there so if there is anything in there particular to it uh I I know at least myself I have not I have
17:02
not read it yet and I'm assuming Matt has not either um but yeah there could be something like that and I'm wondering
17:08
what those biomes would look like the life and death one would be interesting because I think it would be equal parts
17:14
uh Emerald dream and then something like maybe buring on Mal draxis or maybe
17:20
there's an EB and flow between them where there's you know I can't for
17:25
whatever reason it could just be like you know there's there's a plane in the shadowlands that's very forest in in
17:32
autumns to Winter um you know the winter queen and the whole uh I can't name name
17:38
the stupid zones you wrote but you know we've got the death cycle we don't need it to be Mal draxis it could just be
17:46
that place I want to say autumn but it's not it and I can't remember the name and and it could be and it could be uh like
17:53
the uh the area of the Winter Queen uh which is I want want to say Arden weld
18:01
yeah Arden weld yeah ardal so you could have it basically going from Arden weld over to more of a straight up regular
18:08
normal forest or you could have it being like to the extremes on both ends so one
18:13
side is this ridiculous fertile verdant jungle that every so often is bathed in
18:19
darkness and death and you know it's kind of like the the the blood moon in Zelda all of a sudden so the the thing
18:26
that this made me think of is all is going to be very similar to and I'm going to bring this to Warhammer 40K for
18:33
some of the folks that are out there uh the cycle of life and death reminds me a lot of the garden of nurgle in a lot of
18:39
ways so the the grandfather nurgle or the the great demon uh nurgle as in one
18:46
of the four primary chaos Gods is said that the garden that they reside in
18:51
their their plane of existence is life and death allinone because nurgle is the
18:58
process of New Life blooming from the Decay and death of of old life
19:04
terminating uh and there's a certain Beauty in that where you know the garden
19:09
may be uh built on the corpses of of the deceased but from them New Life Springs
19:16
and so you could see something where a life death Crystal if one such existed
19:21
where you see something similar to that where it's life but it's not necessarily
19:26
life in the same way that we would say it's you know perfect and beautiful and exactly what we be looking for it could
19:33
be something where again and I and I use Mal Drax as a sort of like an extreme example but like if you were to take ELD
19:40
and mxus and blend the two together where ELD is this Fantastical over-the-top Larger than Life version of
19:48
like life and rebirth and Mal draxis is literally life from death and combine
19:54
the two of them and get like an over-the-top caricature of what life and death is it could be something that es
20:00
and flows from there it could also be something like Matt was talking about where it's an ardw kind of situation
20:06
that goes through Seasons because the cycle of seasons is often thought to be
20:11
a cycle of of life and death as well winter is often postulated to be
20:17
like a time of renewal but it's also a time where everything you know throughout the fall it's called fall
20:23
because literally leaves fall Decay the fall of life right yeah it's it's so you go through the phases of you know life
20:31
waxing life waning life gibbous I guess if we're going to use the moon uh so you
20:36
have that whole period of time you basically have spring to Summer where life is burgeoning and growing and
20:42
gaining strength and then at the heights of Summer life is actually a little uncomfortable and that's actually one of
20:47
the things that is kept up you the you know the the the horned God is Not Just
20:53
Pleasant he's sometime aggressive even violent and then it moves into winter
20:59
as it goes through Autumn and you have you know the Holly King is replaced by the oak king and you have that whole
21:05
transition um so yeah it it it's quite possible you could do it that way if you wanted to uh I will point out however
21:11
since we're talking about this that uh as Joe mentioned earlier and I went back and made sure to check this out arcadas
21:18
is speculating they found these crystals and they believe their calcified chunks
21:25
of the world Soul's Essence that doesn't mean they are that means arcadis and the
21:30
other Titan forged the the Watchers believe that now keep in mind the the
21:37
the world you know the Watchers have a very specific mindset that they view the
21:43
world through and we've seen that a lot of times um Odin not only is Odin lying
21:48
pretty constantly like when you talk to Odin he constantes you but he doesn't even grasp what he doesn't know like he
21:57
he knows about certain places and certain things and as far as he's concerned that's sufficient the Titans
22:04
made everything if if there's any evidence that they didn't you ignore that so it's possible that these things
22:11
are calcified chunks of the world souls Essence but it's also possible that the
22:17
world Soul itself created things in a specific way I mean from what we know of
22:24
entities like a you know a planet with a world soul in it they are the the original shell is constructed around
22:30
them to allow them to incubate within it so if Azeroth built its shell she could
22:36
have pulled in stuff that that chunk might be something she dragged in rather than something that formed uh we don't
22:43
know we we know very little about this um arcadis is I mean I had to kill the
22:49
guy once because he wouldn't listen to me you know what I mean like like the the Titan forged are not reliable
22:56
Viewpoint characters here um and you got to you got to remember that the the there's a lot going on that
23:03
we're just still learning uh but so I I do want people to be com you know be comfortable with this when they're
23:08
saying St it's not a spaceship it's not an aru maybe it isn't you know I don't know yeah but the thing the thing the
23:14
thing that gets me about it though is the speculation that it's naturally occurring and I I don't I don't know
23:19
that I buy that I don't know that I buy that speculation on the on behalf of arcades well the other thing is let's
23:25
let's assume for a moment it is quote unquote naturally occurring as much as anything can be naturally occurring when
23:31
a world soul is making it happen um we've got we we know for like decades
23:39
that when the uh wound was caused by amanul that that plucked out um yesj and
23:47
created the original site of the original well of Eternity there all all their myths about aoon said that aoon
23:54
went down into that well well every night I mean every day and came up at night and that's how you know we had the
24:00
moon in the sky and I know that could just be myth that that the The Elves and
24:06
others built but think about what if it wasn't we know aloon is out there in the cosmos we know aloon is an entity of
24:13
enormous power that even the Titans themselves cannot just ignore and to the point where AAR and her had some kind of
24:19
relationship which I think was dating um it's quite possible what if she literally did go down in there and one
24:26
of the things you end up with are when she'd go up they would come up as moons
24:32
and maybe they just don't this one doesn't come up anymore yeah we talked about that a little bit earlier yeah we
24:37
talked about that with like the whole Ani and and everything else thing so there's there's definitely a possibility
24:43
right the the problem is we still don't understand the true nature of badar and we don't know where Naru come from and
24:50
we don't know where Nar come from we know that they're related in some way to aloon because the tear of aloon woke up
24:57
a prime kn mhm so if aloon if Naru are derived from
25:03
aoon in some fashion and aloon spends time trying to like mother the world
25:09
Soul you know maybe she's like a fairy godmother to it or like a like the coolant I don't know but if she's been
25:16
going down in there and trying to soothe it for periods of time Ane might have formed you know as part of like you know
25:23
maybe it was her Honor Guard maybe it was just something that formed because she was there and you know the you know
25:29
the world soul on perceiving that aloon was there was trying to essentially
25:35
recreate her much the way that children when you talk to them they try to talk
25:41
back try to talk to a baby and the baby makes noises back at you until someday it suddenly replicates an actual word
25:47
and you're like whoa okay that did did she just say aloon and maybe she tried to say aloon and what she got was badar
25:55
I mean these are all possibilities we don't know any of it we don't know what's going on here I just want to be
26:01
cautious on the idea that we do right and then then everything we say is speculation and so much as you know
26:07
again arcadius is speculating so why aren't we going to speculate here but
26:13
the other thing that I keep thinking about too is that this may have been something that was deliberately placed
26:18
but not by the Titans and the interesting thing is that Remember the
26:23
Titans are analogous to the patri the the pantheon of death
26:28
right they're they're sort of on the same scale if if it were to be believed
26:34
which is why the whole idea of a Titan going to that realm uh you know sort of
26:39
breaks the process uh because it's not made to process that level of power or
26:45
whatever the case is or because it was a robot we we talked about this last week I think quite a bit um but my curiosity
26:52
is what if it was deliberately placed and again coming back to what I've been saying for years or asking about for
26:58
years years which is the whole is Azeroth truly the center of the
27:03
universe and wasn't intentional right was Azeroth perfectly crafted by the
27:11
first ones because the first ones like the other thing that I keep thinking about with with badar is it's a very
27:17
striking geometric shape and yes it's a crystal but it has patterns along the
27:23
edge of it it has uh vertices that go through it and I'm wondering if it's something was placed there
27:29
deliberately uh in the same way of looking back at like like go back and
27:35
take a look at uh the final zone of shadowlands where we're going through
27:40
and making our way through it's a lot of balls it's a lot of Domes and spheres and and almost looks like uh it's trying
27:48
to plan out the universe if for lack of a better term like almost as part of
27:54
their workshop part of what they were doing they were planning what the material plane was going to be uh and as
28:01
you make your way through the Supple cor you know what's the the constant it's Geographic shapes upon Geographic shapes
28:08
or geometric shapes it's fractals it's subdivisions you just me to think of
28:13
something yep go ahead okay the the book where we first find out of the connection between the Naru and The Loon
28:20
is called The Ordering of the universe yep sure is and we've already mentioned
28:26
that badar looks a lot like an arar whether or not you want to say it is one or Naru Crystal it looks like a Naru
28:31
Crystal Ship really it has a very close resemblance I mean it does kind of beg the question what if aoon the reason a
28:38
loon can beat an old God the reason like like a champion of aoon not even a loon herself but a but someone Alona is
28:44
empowering can physically destroy an old God which the Titans can't do what if that's because she's a first one well
28:53
then why would why would uh the Winter Queen call her sister because the Winter
28:59
Queen would have been created by the first ones so I don't know I I don't
29:04
know but the other possibility is is that aloon might have been we've seen this with Titans and Titan Forge
29:11
constructs right where there's there's titanforged beings that are practically like
29:16
robotic and and they serve almost as a database like mother and then there's others that are like much more person
29:22
personable they actually have personalities say what you want about Odin but that dude's choclo of personality too much personality really
29:29
he could dial it back um it's quite possible what how if badar makes you
29:35
think it's somehow involved in the creation of the universe much as uh you know zerth mortis felt like it was part
29:41
of that and we know that zerth morx mortis directly interfaced with Azeroth because it was be being linked to
29:48
Azeroth directly and the device that was being used to do it was very similar to the heart of Azeroth what if Aluna is
29:55
the directory system like the first one ones set up a database this is how this
30:01
is supposed to go in case of problem with Universe working the way it should break glass get you know get the aloon
30:08
online that's why there's a world called alundis where a Titan can go and recover
30:13
because aoon is supposed to be the backup but something bad happens you you
30:19
get aoon to to intervene yeah but then I keep coming back to the idea that there was a a a relationship between Alon and
30:26
uh Anar if if a you know that maybe the relationship was one of I'm here to help
30:32
you and this if it's an AI if it's an intelligent being and not just a
30:38
creation if it's a thing that can think it can talk it can make bonds it can
30:44
have a relationship with AAR it can call the Winter Queen Sister because it
30:49
recognizes that she too is a creation of the first one I don't know but I do know
30:55
that it's seeming kind of odd right now that Bellar looks so much like a Naru Crystal Ship
31:01
we know there's a relationship between aloon and and the Naru because otherwise
31:06
that Crystal wouldn't have done anything so we know this stuff is there but we don't know what it is yeah and I mean
31:13
the other thing that I was I was going through earlier was that if they were placed there by the first ones these
31:20
might be focusing crystals and this might not be the first one that they've done because again we talked might one
31:27
there might be one up in freaking ice Crown because that's the one that zerth mortise was shooting at there could be
31:33
one in ice Crown there but I'm saying that there could have been also on other planets that existed uh seen evidence of
31:40
this what did we talk about with Argus what did we talk about with uh you know dror there were highly powerful crystals
31:48
and Crystal Creations that were there like the apexis but not even just the
31:53
apexis going back and and looking at the original crystals that uh the
31:59
well I'm going to keep calling them the draai but they weren't the draai at the time the aidar um like the crystal that
32:05
had existed long before they can even remember nobody remembers where they came from Von doesn't know where they came from but they do know that he just
32:11
knew he could use it to contact the Naru and that they were really good at focusing power and focusing energy which
32:20
is a staple of also the same thing with the apexis crystals and crystals that we saw in dror and crystals that we found
32:27
elsewhere the apexus weren't the crystals that were originally on dror the apexus were the crystals that the
32:33
the bird folk I want to call them the aexis yeah the arra they studied these
32:39
other that might be the D andd creature I don't remember I think it's arcoa but eroa yeah they studied the the crystals
32:47
and then created the apexis which then the the ogres studied in turn and used
32:53
to do what they did Magic with it amongst other things they actually almost they invaded something like the
33:00
the the ogres we see when we go to dror on that continent that we're on came from somewhere else they came from
33:06
another continent they they came to conquer so there's a lot and we also
33:11
know that but Dr is a weird place because uh the the a Titan came there
33:17
and did stuff directly but just one of them and he was in a hurry so it's like
33:22
a simpler version of what happened to Azeroth so I I don't know that there but I keep back to this idea that there's
33:29
something about like you're talking about this you're talking about the focusing crystals thing well and that's what I wanted to finish go ahead go
33:35
ahead I wanted to finish the thought on that because again going back to the focusing Crystal these could be deliberately placed as a way of the
33:43
first ones trying to harness these Elemental forces it could also be why the Titans were born with the the way
33:50
that they are essentially cuz we don't know that the planets that they were uh
33:55
found within uh that they naturally formed around them it could have been orchestrated to harvest or uh to
34:03
basically uh incubate a world Soul into a Titan for their purpose and they may
34:11
have had crystals in them as well that Focus certain elements and maybe due to their proximity to those planes or or
34:18
the Attunement of those crystals lean them closer to One Direction or another
34:23
because again we've talked about this before the pantheon all seem to havee elements that they're very comfortable
34:29
with uh specific like aspects of the Multiverse or universe that they tend to
34:35
embody more than the others and while they all have the ability to touch the Arcane and and cause ordering I mean
34:42
again going to Anar Anar is all about that life magic it's all about that chaos is all about that that what you
34:48
would consider the plane of life you have others that are definitely more keen to order and and that Arcane you
34:55
have others that seem to be able to harness that of Fire uh very very well you have those that seem to be uh very keen with the Earth
35:02
as well and I don't just mean like digging their their fingers into it but I mean look at dror look at what
35:10
happened in Warlords when we dealt with the gron and everything else where did they start from they started because a
35:16
Titan saw the planet saw that it was being consumed by uh plant life that was being unchecked and turned rock into
35:22
living things that just then propagated into other living things going back to
35:28
Matt's whole thing of Orcs are the uh gnomes of dror which is accurate uh so it's also entirely
35:35
possible that this was all experimentation by the first ones and
35:40
azoth has many of these crystals with sort of that dual nature because it just happens to be perfectly equidistant to
35:47
everything which is why zerth mortise you know connects to it it may have connected to all of them we don't know
35:53
we know that it was essentially a computer room right here here's my thing though we Darth mortis connected to
35:58
something beneath the engine that arthus made and keep mind arthus made that while he was the Lich King he was in in
36:05
the helmet in the body he made that engine the the the engine of souls that
36:11
we see which would make sense because again the engine of the makers is right near there too there's there's a bunch of
36:17
Titan facilities that are literally right next door it would not be obscene to to to make the suggestion that there
36:23
might be a Titan thing underneath it he was and the when when the ER old uh I
36:29
now I can't remember his real name Z yeah usually I I call him zoval and can't remember that he was the he was
36:34
the Jailer um when former Arbiter zoval the Jailer was trying to connect to
36:40
Azeroth through zerth mortise he was attempting to hit something that would allow him to create a universal reset on
36:48
all creation if there is a badar sized Crystal that does the life death flip
36:55
underneath ice Crown like way underneath that might be what he was trying to hit
37:01
to basically just wipe the universe just kill it and then remake it because that
37:06
would be the uplip side of a life death's Crystal right and I keep thinking about this in terms of if
37:13
Azeroth contains a crystal for every zerth if there's a zerth foris which we
37:19
know there is then there's an order chaos Crystal somewhere that zerth ortis
37:24
would connect with where would that be where would these things be are are they all well deep beneath the surface of the
37:32
world are they necessarily in physical Co terminos with the you know the the
37:39
portals to the zerth we don't know because we don't know where the zerth portals are supposed to be or if there's even supposed to be any but thinking
37:46
about if they're all there if the planet has like one for each force it would
37:51
only need what there's like eight forces that we see on the aary
37:57
so we' only need four now you were talking about Argus and you mentioned like that you know there's there might
38:03
be something like that on Argus we we literally know there is y well we have an Taurus well not not only an Taurus
38:10
but we literally go to structures that were crafted from crystals use as harnessing elements that the void was
38:17
using we know that those things existed but what we don't know is if there is
38:23
actually see you mentioned Argus and you mentioned dror and that's what got me thinking when you go to dror there's
38:29
that place that that's trying to tell you it's that we keep getting told that it looks Titan created there's that one
38:35
place with that big plate and the magaron are all like you know worshiping it what if it wasn't a Titan who made
38:43
that what if it was already there and the reason that agramar thought oh I
38:48
can't just let this world die is because he saw it and knew what it meant like oh
38:55
this is a first one world I can't let it just be crushed to death under its own weight that that that that may not be
39:03
the case though because I think we know that I don't know if we know the Titans knew all about the first ones did they
39:09
we don't but we we have no idea but they might have known something like if if it seems possible that the guy who is
39:17
obsessed with order Magic was aware of the existence of his counterpart who was
39:22
obsessed with domination magic since the power seems to be very similar to the point where you can control things with
39:28
it we know that the Titans controlled demons with it the Titans were fully aware demons existed and that they came from outside of reality they would have
39:34
known that other such places might exist I'm just we don't know and so we're speculating as you pointed out but it
39:41
seems to me it's worth speculating if agramar saw a first one mark on a world
39:47
if he knew what the first ones were and the thing where Odin is lying about the first ones implies that agramar would
39:55
have known about them since agamar is an ual Titan and Odin is not that to me
40:00
says that there's possibilities for like if you're creating if Azeroth is the is the Cornerstone world the gemstone world
40:07
the one in the center that serves as the the focal point of this whole thing then what are the other worlds in the cosmos
40:13
for why are there so many other planets so that's the thing that I think that that and going back to it I I don't know
40:20
that maybe the first ones completely understood How the Universe would travel
40:26
if that makes sense because but I think that they're going to need to still have hot houses they're going to need to have
40:33
like we have on Azeroth the petri dish of the Titans right but I think I what I'm saying is I think that I every
40:40
planet was planned to be Azeroth in whichever one's stuck may have been just luck of the draw that azth that azoth
40:47
was just the lucky one that happened to find its its gravitational Cosmic Center in the center of the universe well we
40:54
for that matter we don't really know what center of the universe means in this case yeah we have no idea but I I don't think
41:00
we can dismiss the idea that they did have plans and directives and sure we
41:07
can't I'm not disputing that I mean and so they might have had worlds where they were working on things and if you look
41:14
at dror dror looks like a really good place to be working on specifically the
41:20
balances that keep life going and how life can fall into death because as like
41:27
you know you're looking at dror what happens life goes crazy and that even
41:33
might be why Titans exist because you create dror a world that's perfectly
41:39
viable for life but it doesn't have a world soul and so all that Spirit energy
41:44
that is essentially Ana doesn't go anywhere it just stays there on that
41:49
planet and it's like we know that when things die theira should go back to this
41:54
the shadowlands right but on granor there the the ana never went back cuz
42:00
the planet was just overflowing with life and that life the plant life was going to crush the planet under its own
42:06
weight and that's what agramar saw when he got there and he was just like I got to stop this what if the entire reason
42:12
that we have things like Titans and the pantheon of death and so forth is
42:18
because left without them the system doesn't run why do we need an Arbiter
42:24
obviously we need an Arbiter because somebody has to tell the where to go right there has to be somebody there
42:30
that can shunt Thea to the part of the Shadow needed and and I'm on the same page right we we've talked about this a
42:35
lot where that is most likely the case is that the shadowlands only works uh if
42:42
the system is being monitored which is why you need them and you need the Arbiter you need the individuals that
42:48
are tied to the domain in order to spend that thing they only work in the shadowlands so you need somebody to make
42:56
sure stuff goes to the Shadowland the reason a Titan isn't supposed to be in the shadowlands could be because Titans
43:02
exist to serve as directors they serve to get Thea to go
43:09
into a world Soul creating a new world soul and in the process sending Ana to
43:16
the shadowlands like when they're done the they you know Thea that they're
43:21
getting fed maybe it some of it goes into the shadowlands or maybe the whole purpose is to direct of the shadowlands
43:28
but you'll know that on a world that didn't have Titan agramar had to step in
43:34
to get that world to run properly there's no world Soul here so I have to basically do this thing to create
43:41
something that will keep this from going out of control and I don't have time to do it cleanly so I'm gonna have to just
43:48
make a gigantic Monster Mountain that will then get destroyed but in the process create many many more offspring
43:56
that will eventually become the smartest thing on the planet Orcs um so yeah I just I really don't know what I'm
44:03
talking about but I do think there's something here about what these things are what they're for why do we have
44:10
Titan why do we have Naru why do we have whatever f aloon is you know what what
44:16
did the first ones literally just throw their little idea into the cosmos and
44:22
then just step back and see what happens because because it might be what they did right this all might be like like
44:29
making a solution and then getting it to oversaturate so that crystals form once the crystals start forming you just
44:35
watch so you you know what I mean like that that's there's there's this overarching thing of are we in a
44:41
directed situation or are we in like we're now looking at a chemical reaction happening the entire universe I think
44:48
it's both right like and I think that's what everything has lean has has sort of led us to believe is that there's a
44:54
level of calculation by the old ones and this might be part of it these crystals might be part of it of course there could be no other crystals this could be
45:00
a one-off this could be something that just badar could be unique um but it
45:07
seems like with shadowlands with everything we learned there and what we've learned in in in uh the dragon
45:14
ises and what we've learned so far here is that maybe the Titans didn't have any
45:19
bloody idea either they had an inkling they had a directive maybe they knew the first ones existed maybe that they knew
45:25
the first ones gave life to the universe but they don't necessarily know what that means and from even here we see
45:32
arcadas doesn't know what the crystal is has no idea what that Crystal is and is
45:38
speculating that there are other crystals aligned with other Cosmic forces throughout Azeroth but why he
45:44
never speculates at least not that I've seen so far uh in so much as to where they came from why they there why they
45:52
exist just that there might be more of them and that may be the case and it may be it may be a like a seeding
46:00
situation where they threw uh shards of this entity like out into the wild and
46:06
into the universe and that's what formed the planets uh it could be that or it
46:12
could be that they were placed there specifically or directly it maybe a combination of the two uh and because we
46:18
already know that whatever the first one's planned we're already off that beaten path like we've we've far
46:25
exceeded whatever the simulation said we were supposed to be uh I don't know that the Titans were specifically planned the
46:31
way they were but I mean again it could be it could be that the reason that they're so cosmically aligned is that
46:37
they were placed uh deliberately to harness those uh those particular uh
46:43
forces those Cosmic forces uh and to embody it in the Physical Realm uh
46:48
because again that's the other thing to remember too is the shadowlands is an ethereal realm right like it has a
46:55
physical form but that form can sh at the drop of a hat uh the people that run
47:00
those areas could change how those areas look and feel and what what they
47:08
basically down to the core if they so wanted to or if their programming allowed them to um looking at the pure
47:15
essence of life looking at the emerald dream the emerald dream is Raw Creation or raw potential right it's just this
47:21
ever burgeoning life uh that again is in often cases fantastic iCal and overblown
47:28
we don't know what the realm of arcan looks like we kind of have an idea of what you know the realm of death looks
47:34
like we don't know what the other cosm we don't know what the realm of light looks like or or what that would even
47:40
begin to be but these barely know what the what the you know nether is but
47:46
these are seen bits and pieces of the twisting nether but we don't know you know is this the realm of chaos is this
47:52
you know the pure fell what is it or or is it or is it just the the the space between Stars is it the space between
47:57
entities is it the cosmic soup that holds everything is the dark Beyond is the Great Dark Beyond and the twisting
48:03
nether are they coterminous are they the same thing are is one a border onto the other like you can imagine there's a
48:08
realm of pure chaos then there's a the shadow border between them that is the twisting nether then there's the Great
48:15
Dark Beyond in which all worlds live like our world like we don't and what exists and then what
48:21
exists exists beyond that which is where uh the anima consuming uh devourers come
48:26
from and are maybe potentially where this ominous threat to the to all life and existence uh is potentially coming
48:34
from there's that realm outside of it too and how does that play into it are we in a pocket Dimension inside of a
48:39
vast cosmic space uh and all of these Realms are also just little tiny Pockets
48:46
inside of that that giant sea of chaos and potential like there are so many things we don't know still to this day
48:54
that everything is just pure speculation and and we're going to get answers at least to some of these right and we know
49:00
that for effect we know that as this Trilogy proceeds forward uh that we're
49:06
going to know more about the Titans we're going to know more about their plans we're going to know more about what they actually knew because that's
49:12
the biggest problem we have no idea what they actually knew we don't and like the
49:18
Watchers don't know how deep that knowledge went either even the ones that were possessed of the Titan Essence
49:23
don't know how deep that well of knowledge goes and and we have yet to
49:29
uncover what the truth is regarding that and as it's been hinted it's not going to be necessarily something we feel
49:35
great about but why is it because they have a specific task that runs
49:40
counterintuitive to us because like so many other times we've proven before we are not part of the scheduled
49:46
programming uh that we are not exactly what was expected that we are not the
49:52
life that they thought was going to be on these planets generating Thea uh to feed both the world soul and the
49:59
shadowlands or is it because there's something more Sinister to their actions because they know more than we do uh and
50:05
they are going to try to circumvent life to their own needs uh to you know air quote preserve the universe and turns
50:12
out that they're actually weird villains and that's why anr didn't get along with the rest of them because that's what
50:17
ordering is ordering is taking the life bending it to your will and anr is like yeah I'm not about that and maybe that's
50:24
where Alon comes into the into it as well like you said maybe alon's an AI program maybe aloon is a in case of
50:31
emergency break glass maybe that emergency is the Titans right yeah or maybe it's just everything is not
50:37
working the way it's supposed to or when zoval tried to do the thing he tried to do the first time which got him
50:45
debited that triggered this universe's version of an Arbiter maybe they're
50:50
supposed to be a being in every one of these cosmoses that serves to keep
50:56
things Reg regulated and it's awake because of that problem like the system's not working properly we don't
51:02
know we know it's quite possible that the devourers are a known threat I mean
51:08
obviously zoval knew about them yeah I mean or zal knows more than he told us
51:15
to and my guess abely and my guess is that we also uh the Primus knows more
51:22
than he lets on as well he's not telling us anything which the Primus has got me thinking every every so often I think
51:28
the Primus is there's there's some creepy bleeps going on with the Primus man well I mean
51:34
think that guy I start to think to myself I sometimes wonder if zoval was
51:39
more of a convenient py than anything else and it's entirely possible but here's here's the other thing that we we
51:45
we and we talk about this here the Primus knows more about what's going on than he's letting on zal knew a lot a
51:53
whole lot right um so why didn't the
51:58
others know and I mean I'm guessing it's because they had been reset at some point uh I think we both speculated that
52:06
at some point um they were probably all reset except for the Primus and it very
52:13
possible the Primus itself is the one that did the resetting uh and maybe not zoval because zoval or maybe it's what
52:19
caused zal to become fractured in the first place and lose and lose their sanity um you know where it's en enely
52:27
possible that the Primus he may not be a bad guy but he definitely knows more
52:32
than he's sharing and if the Titans know more than they're sharing and the Primus knows more than they're sharing we're in
52:39
for trouble right we're probably going to have to beat the snot out of these things to kind of get them to tell us what we want to know uh you know maybe
52:46
grab their toe and twist it or something like that but I'm hoping we can skip straight to Odin let's just beat up Odin I want to beat up OD so badly I just I I
52:54
will never not want to beat up Odin there it's it is a wholesome family activity and I
52:59
will stand by that but again we're going to find out more in the next two expansions we don't know what Midnight's
53:06
going to be yet we know it's going to be something to do with the darkest hour probably something to do with what the plans are with rron in the void and very
53:14
likely uh zotth and that's all going to lead up somehow because keep in mind
53:20
everything that's happening now is part of that trilogy and everything leads back to the Titans the last Titan it
53:27
leads back to what we're going to do there so all of this is tied into that
53:32
story arc why and where it's going we're going to find out but it's we have time
53:38
now the interesting thing is going to be we have we're literally in the first tier of the expansion right we're just
53:44
coming up on the the interstitial patch where we get the siren aisle sir not you know it's just a little border before we
53:51
get into the next yeah bigger it's a side before the next tier and The Tear
53:57
generally are where we find a lot of stuff and we're going to the undermine right there might be a crystal in the
54:03
undermine there might that might be the real reason goblins are goblins it might not be uh you know them finding the the
54:11
the Kaja Cola or the uh I can't remember the name of the the actual kite might the kite might actually be chunks of
54:18
that thing it could be it could be pieces of that of the crystal that was there and it could be crystals like we
54:23
talked about what if there's a life and and death Crystal it could be pieces of a Life Crystal which is why they mutated
54:28
and turned into how the the intelligence they did there could be something there or they could have just discovered it
54:33
and that's why there's this massive mining operation right because again motherload was a thing it was a mining
54:40
operation it was a mining town and yeah it was for azerite but they seemed a little too well prepared for that if you
54:45
don't remind me saying like they had the equipment just right to M azerite uh how
54:52
did they get that so quickly and yeah I understand Goblin safety standards blah blah blah blah but it seems like it's
54:58
almost something they've been doing for a while and it seems like something that maybe trade Prince Gallow Wick might
55:04
know more about as well and he's speaking of ones I can't wait to punch in the face that's another one I can't wait to punch in the face alwick
55:11
definitely deserves to be punched in the face yeah uh but again we don't know what Secrets they know we don't know
55:16
what Secrets uh they've uncovered in the undermine for as long as they've been going there and it could be part of that
55:24
as well there could be another Crystal there and if there is another Crystal there it could have its own uh dual nature and it could be part of the whole
55:32
burgeoning biome underneath under mine cuz we haven't seen undermine yet we don't know what undermine looks like we don't know what the biomes of undermine
55:38
are going to be so there's we are we are living in a space of infinite potential
55:44
which is fantastic and terrible all at the same time but I think fan terrible
55:50
fan terrible you got it I'm going to I'm going to I'm going to go with that one but I don't have anything else to add to
55:55
that I've to talk a little bit so I'm content is there anything else you want to add Matt no I think I'm more in the
56:01
place where I keep having ideas rather than I have anything specific just you keep talking about it boom you know what
56:07
I mean fair enough but I think we're g to call it there uh so again blizzard
56:12
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56:29
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56:40
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56:46
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57:04
well that folks we'll see you next week [Music]
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